Master Resource: General Public Discussions of men in heels

[SF]

To tell a family secret, I have a cousin my age, who is openly gay, and a great guy - like all my relatives, haha.  He dresses as a guy and knows that I wear gals shoes - in public even.  

I guess that makes me, the straight guy, more of a cross dresser than him!!  Go figure, so much for stereotypes. 

Take care all.   sf

[Rockpup]

On 5/8/2018 at 10:36 PM, Heelster said:

And i'd venture to guess, most didn't dress as some would expect a gay group too. That's what I find hilarious. All the gay men I know, and I know quite a few, don't dress any different than straight men. I find they dress a bit better, but not different.

Other then pink skate laces and a rainbow Jersey I suspect this is not much different then a photo of any pickup hockey game between friends.

[Shyheels]

Well, you don't see the pink laces and as far as rainbow jerseys go, the world road cycling champion is awarded a rainbow jersey - and that has nothing to do with sexual orientation (any more than the pink jersey at the Giro d'Italia does)  so I would say it looks exactly like any other hockey team.  

[Cali]

I had my first somewhat negative reaction in a shoe store yesterday. I was at a Steve Madden store in a large mall yesterday. The staff welcome me as usual and one of the SAs came over to personally welcome me and she had seen me in some time. I have bought and returned (on-line) shoes there, so they (the SA) treat me very well. I had asked to try a pair of shoes on and they were finding them for me. An Asian woman was also shopping at the same time and they brought both of our shoes out at the same time, giving her's first (closes to the her and then mine. So I took off a bootie and was trying on the heels and the Asian woman said "Those are girls shoes"

"I know, 4 inch heels."

"But those are girls shoes, why you try on?"

At this point I had slipped on the heel and was looking at how it fit, so I lifted the bootie I had just taken off up (It had 4 inch heels) and said "I wear heels for my back" and continued trying them on. The SA came over and I asked if they had a larger size in the back, no (that's normal for them to only carry to size 10 in stores and 11 only on-line) and if they were leather or not, not.

They were just a little too tight so I didn't get them. Took off the one heel I had tried on, put my bootie back on and went to look at the Aldo's store next door.  The Aldo store didn't have size 10 in the styles I wanted to try on.

[pebblesf]

Great job handling yourself buddy...At least the woman was up front and honest, instead of giggling/criticizing behind your back...

[MackyHeels]

1 hour ago, Cali said:

I had my first somewhat negative reaction in a shoe store yesterday. I was at a Steve Madden store in a large mall yesterday. The staff welcome me as usual and one of the SAs came over to personally welcome me and she had seen me in some time. I have bought and returned (on-line) shoes there, so they (the SA) treat me very well. I had asked to try a pair of shoes on and they were finding them for me. An Asian woman was also shopping at the same time and they brought both of our shoes out at the same time, giving her's first (closes to the her and then mine. So I took off a bootie and was trying on the heels and the Asian woman said "Those are girls shoes"

"I know, 4 inch heels."

"But those are girls shoes, why you try on?"

At this point I had slipped on the heel and was looking at how it fit, so I lifted the bootie I had just taken off up (It had 4 inch heels) and said "I wear heels for my back" and continued trying them on. The SA came over and I asked if they had a larger size in the back, no (that's normal for them to only carry to size 10 in stores and 11 only on-line) and if they were leather or not, not.

They were just a little too tight so I didn't get them. Took off the one heel I had tried on, put my bootie back on and went to look at the Aldo's store next door.  The Aldo store didn't have size 10 in the styles I wanted to try on.

Always my fear when going into stores, getting reactions from not only SA but female customers. Confusion of Asian lady is common with woman seeing us guys in heels or feminine outfits. Stupid question she exclaimed putting you on the spot in front of everyone to react. If that happened to me I would feel little upset observing other people in the store. Would of ignored the question or replied with angery tone cause I like it, free country isn’t it,  belittling her ethnic background of communist country she immigrated from. 

Definetly would observe any facial reactions like a smirk, smear or nodding of the head in agreement, comments such as “ I know”  by others towards the Asian lady. 

The experience does show how woman are confused puzzled why men would wear woman shoes. Suppose woman you seen at the store comes from a poor background. Having difficult time finding shoes when growing up in another country. Needing to share shoes  with males because selections were few or none to begin with. Now that she is in modern western country where abundance of choices  styles for both genders  to buy what heart desires. She believes no man should limit themselves to only woman shoes, as it may have been necessity in her child years. Her understanding go shop for men’s shoes they have a lot to choose from. Yet she doesn’t understand the niche heel market at a store doesn’t sell to men. Sort of like trying to buy thong underwear for men not finding adequate selections like woman experience. Just my opinion excusing the Asian woman’s mindset what she believes in. 

 

Had experience with a female married acquaintance. She asked me what size I wear in my outfits. Thinking to herself she may want to buy me a souvenir running  tank top. She asked if I would wear triathalon top, styled like a woman’s athletic bra? I laughed remembering owning one Nike female bra top. It looked good on me but I hesitated wearing it because some would laugh upon me wearing it in the gym. If I were running many wouldn’t think much to it. Well I told her yes I owned wore one before but never told her it was bra top. 

She asked what size clothes I wear in fitness apparel? I told her size 4. She balked asking what are you saying confused. I nodded thinking yah I wear a 4. She didn’t understand what that meant nor did I understand her confusion thinking I was that slender. 

She told me there are sizes small medium large what are you, don’t give me these numbers. Low and behold it suddenly hit me, never occurred to her I be wearing woman’s fitness clothes all this time she seen me. I told her i’m Small but observed others listening in grinning fully aware I was wearing woman clothes and that I was describing the size in numbers. 

If I break it to my female friend I wear woman gym clothes she might find it odd and shun me like other woman do fully aware what style gender I wear,

Edited May 10, 2018 by MackyHeels

[jeremy1986]

5 hours ago, MackyHeels said:

 

If I break it to my female friend I wear woman gym clothes she might find it odd and shun me like other woman do fully aware what style gender I wear,

What kind of woman doesn't realize from the look and size that you are wearing women's clothes??

[MackyHeels]

29 minutes ago, jeremy1986 said:

What kind of woman doesn't realize from the look and size that you are wearing women's clothes??

She isn't dumb but sometimes doesn't realize her surroundings. Often when i see her in the gym i walk up nearby she doesn't realize it's me until i say something, then she smiles tells me i didn't see you. Maybe she does realize my clothes can be unisex such as leggings doesn't matter what gender i choose to wear. But she is clueless with woman's sizing often picking for herself xs or small in running tights while some brands don't calculate it by numbers as i purchase from lululemon.  For example she maybe confused what a  0-2 sizing which can equal xxs, 2-4 sizing is xs, etc.. 

She often smiles telling me i purchase  and are seen always in very tight clothes compression wear. Maybe she  thinks i buy men's running tights and  tops not aware of the brand or limited choices to choose from on the men's side. Either way don't matter i mock her telling she needs children sizes because how skinny she is 90 lbs. 

Edited May 10, 2018 by MackyHeels

[Cali]

The store was basically empty. There was a woman making a purchase and she left as the Asian woman entered. At that Steve Madden store I'm a known customer since I've bought several pairs of heels there over the past three years. The SA know me and come over to talk every time I enter the store. And they know I like HIGH heels, higher than some of SA can wear so they always give me excellent help while ignoring other customers. 

I chose to be kind in my response to her, better to be kind (and mess with her mind) than get angry and make a scene. I want to be welcomed in that store, I love my Steve Madden, Madden Girl, and Freebird heels.

[kneehighs]

"I Wore Heels for Men and No One Even Cared, " TEENVOGUE.COM

Concluding statement, "...everyone will finally realize: gender-specific dressing is BS."

Edited May 27, 2018 by kneehighs

[Shyheels]

Enforcing it certainly is

[Puffer]

The sentiment may be correct but I don't think that what is pictured does us many favours.   The ankle boots look smart and perfectly acceptable for male street wear, but hairy bare legs and a kilt are scarcely attractive, regardless of the footwear.   And add a pair of clumpy platform Mary Janes (especially the red ones) and we have a look that is close to absurd - those shoes are plain ugly on anyone (male, female or undecided), although Minnie Mouse may approve.   Gender-specific dressing may well be BS; appropriate dressing is not.

[Shyheels]

I totally agree. The exemplars that are put up for men in heels are almost always either gay, or absurd, or both.

[JeffB]

9 hours ago, kneehighs said:

"I Wore Heels for Men and No One Even Cared, " TEENVOGUE.COM

Concluding statement, "...everyone will finally realize: gender-specific dressing is BS."

Hmm! An interesting article, but, God almighty, those hairy legs! UGH!! 

[Steve63130]

I thoroughly agree with the comments above. He should have either shaved his legs, or better yet, worn black tights. It would have been an easy addition to the wardrobe which would have made the outfits much more acceptable.

Steve

[Mr. X]

That article may have brought light to the situation but not necessarily the best light.

[CAT]

3 hours ago, Steve63130 said:

I thoroughly agree with the comments above. He should have either shaved his legs, or better yet, worn black tights. It would have been an easy addition to the wardrobe which would have made the outfits much more acceptable.

Steve

Totally agree!  I have always kept my legs trimmed and wore thicker tights most of the time.  If I was going to wear fishnets I trimmed a little closer.  Only recently got said #%€k it and keep them completely shaved smooth.  Should have doe this a long time ago. I still like the thicker tights but I am buying a bunch of thin sheer nylons.    

[Cali]

The trouble is the person who "dress him" has no idea what is worn today and dress him in an outfit from an earlier decade.  Of course he looked out of placed.  Example is JeffB, he dresses in modern clothing and doesn't look out of place.

 

If you like less hair on your legs you just got to get them waxed. It gets easier every time and thinner too.

[5150PLB1]

Hairy legs with a kilt is appropriate if you are in a Highland infantry regiment like the Back Watch or the Argyle and Sutherland Highlanders, but then again you would be wearing combat boots, and all of your mates would also have hairy legs. 

[Jkrenzer]

Actually, I don't shave my legs and I wear heels, in shorts but no "female" attire. My legs are not the hairest anyway, but I don't conceal who or what I am. I'm a guy in heels with no problem as such. Take me for who I am or move on, I simply don't care. All my neighbors see me and deal with me with no care while I wear extremely high feminine heels hairy legs and all. If guys want to be accepted in heels than we shouldn't have try to present ourselves as women to do so. Personally nothing against full out cross dressing or trans, but that's not going to be me nor should it have to be. 

[Shyheels]

There appears to be a lot of people here who view wearing heels as a handy justification for cross dressing

[Bubba136]

My attitude is identical to that of Jkrenzer’s.  I stopped caring what others thought of my wearing heels years ago.  People can react anyway they want to. As far as I’m concerned, people have three choices - ridicule, laugh or just leave me alone. 

[Shyheels]

And I’ll bet that in the vast majority of cases they just leave you alone. Most people really don’t care or notice.

[Cali]

2 hours ago, Bubba136 said:

My attitude is identical to that of Jkrenzer’s.  I stopped caring what others thought of my wearing heels years ago.  People can react anyway they want to. As far as I’m concerned, people have three choices - ridicule, laugh or just leave me alone. 

Your missing the most important choice, compliment.

3 hours ago, Shyheels said:

There appears to be a lot of people here who view wearing heels as a handy justification for cross dressing

Since most high heels are women's, technicality when you wear women's heels you are cross dressing.  I blend my clothing from both sides, pick the best of what I want to wear. Some comes from the men's side, some from the women's side; it's about what fits best, function best, and looks good, not what the label says. 

[Shyheels]

I disagree. Wearing heels on their own is not cross-dressing - technically or otherwise unless you wish to dilute the term to such an extent that it becomes meaningless.  

[kneehighs]

I think the term cross dressing can connote that one is attempting to pass as the opposite sex.  Which is why over a decade ago we invented the term "fashion freestyling" to avoid triggering negative connotations.

Regarding the TeenVogue.com article, I'm grateful the article moves the needle for future generations: Gen Z and Millennials.  IMHO, it does more good than it does bad, especially when seen through the eyes of the Teen Vogue audience.  I can't imagine how much TeenVogue.com would charge for equal advertising space either.  That's worth money too.

[Shyheels]

Yes, there does seem to be a shift amongst those generations. And yet the other day I read an article about loosening up of fashion styles - but it was all about women feeling freer to express themselves through fashion; not a word about men.

[Heelster]

13 hours ago, Shyheels said:

I disagree. Wearing heels on their own is not cross-dressing - technically or otherwise unless you wish to dilute the term to such an extent that it becomes meaningless.  

I'm with you on this - I may wear heels and  women's jeans out and about, but there is no way someone is going to see anything but a guy. With my thinning hair, big beard, and proverbial spare tire, It's not happening.

[Puffer]

We've been down this route before - and the jury is still out, it seems.   In my book, wearing anything that is conventionally worn (or intended to be worn) by the opposite gender is, by definition, 'cross-dressing'.   The extent is unimportant and the term is not in itself pejorative and does not imply either any true intention to pass as the other gender, any medical condition or any conduct of a fetishistic nature.   That said, a deliberate and structured adoption of opposite-gender clothing (together with the use of cosmetics etc, if necessary) may well allow 'passing' in practice and may be a component of other broader conduct.   

I would distinguish 'fashion freestyling' (a useful and more neutral term) to denote simply the adoption and wearing of whatever clothes etc the wearer chooses (which may or may not include cross-dressing), regardless of their actual or alleged allegiance or the effect they may produce.   And that freedom of expression and conduct is, I would suggest, something that we would all like to see as acceptable - indeed, commonplace - regardless of any labels that may be (mis)applied to it.

[Bubba136]

Ok, I'll agree with that!