To Dress, or To Overdress?

[Cali]

I'm one of those that wears polish on both my hands and feet; I don't do it to look like a woman, I do it because I like to express myself that way. When you wear high heel sandals most of the year, you better have nice looking toes. If you don't expose your toes, you may not understand this.

About half my clothes started in the women's section, but I don't think of them as women's clothes because they're mine. For me its function and comfort over what side of store it came from. I prefer tighter fitting clothes, light compression over loose fitting. I like compression on my legs when doing sports, so I have many leggings. I don't wear women's pants because they don't meet my needs. And I not into skirts or dresses.

I'm not trying to look or dress as a woman, I just blend my clothes together.

[Steve63130]

Interesting discussion so far. I typically wear women's bootcut jeans, winter and summer, because I have found a brand that fits and looks great on me (Torrid). In winter I wear mostly women's turtlenecks because I inherited them as hand-me-downs from my wife, and the shirts fit me perfectly. In summer I wear polo shirts, which are mostly men's or unisex. I wear men's underwear (www.comfilon.com) and men's tights and pantyhose (www.activskin.com). I'm too stocky (short but wide) to look good in stilettos, so I generally wear thicker heels, usually in the 2-4" range. I have lots of clogs, mules, and boots for winter, plus some pumps and mary janes when it's dry out. In summer it's heeled sandals. I frequently wear ballet flats too, for a more casual look. Like Cali, I like to express myself with nail polish on both fingers and toes. It gives the message, like it does for women, that I care about grooming and about my appearance enough to take the time to make my nails look good. I always carry a shoulder bag for my stuff so my pockets don't bulge with all the junk I carry. I don't wear cosmetics but I do color my hair so it's not so gray. I never wear skirts and rarely wear shorts. I think my heels look better with bootcut jeans, so if I want to wear heels, I don't wear shorts.

So I tend to mix and match from both sides of the aisle and wear what I like and what I think makes me look good. It must be working okay. We moved into a retirement community over 3 years ago, and I have lots of friends here. None of the other residents or the staff has EVER made a comment on my choices of clothing or footwear, and they've seen me in women's shoes, quite exposed, every day. I'd cause the older residents to have heart attacks if I wore men's shoes! LOL. The one exception is the staff - my gal pals - in the marketing department when I visit them - they're as passionate about shoes as I am, and wear heels often because they meet with the public and want to make a good impression. I enjoy my visits there but I have to be careful not to do it too often and become a pest. Fortunately I do a lot to help them out, so I'm always welcomed - with hugs, no less - and we often chat about the latest heels in our closets!). 

Steve

[Shyheels]

My main gripe with men's fashion is colour choice - and that is restricted right across the board, whether you are buying 'men's' backpacks or men's shirts or anything else labelled 'men's'. I have never been afraid of colour and wish the makers of men's clothing would broaden their palettes a bit. One area where this is happening is at the fashionable end of men's cycling clothing, where nobody runs in fear of pink or burgundy, and the difference between men's and women's wear is the sensible matter of cut for body shapes and position on the bicycle, rather than styling or colour. It would be nice if makers of street clothes would follow this lead. 

[Steve63130]

You're absolutely right, Shyheels! Yesterday my wife and I were walking along a local bike path, and way ahead of us we could see a biker taking a rest. All I could make out was bright red shoes, so naturally I thought it was a female. As we got closer, I could see it was a male, and I thought, "Good for him!" He moved on in the same direction we were going, so I never had a chance to compliment him.

Steve

[Shyheels]

Last year the Bata Shoe Museum in Toronto sponsored a travelling exhibition on sneaker culture. I never saw it but I read a few reviews. According to remarks by the curator, quite an interesting person, modern sneaker culture is one area where men are starting to feel more comfortable expressing themselves with brighter, more unusual colours - a very good thing as far as I am concerned.

I was in an outdoors store in Wales not too long ago and all of the parkas for men were either black, or a very standard blue, or a very standard brick red. That was it. End of options. Women’s parkas on the other hand  - from the same companies, and pretty much the same designs - came in a rainbow of interesting shades and colours.

[Cali]

 

19 hours ago, Shyheels said:

My main gripe with men's fashion is colour choice...... It would be nice if makers of street clothes would follow this lead. 

Shyheels why are you waiting...

I found if an item functions better and comes in more choices who cares if it is marketed at women.  Take my turtlenecks, they are all women's (TALL). They fit better than men's, more comfortable, can be layer better, and I have more color options. I even have a few long sleeve turtleneck bodysuits. Also I have sleeveless turtlenecks which are extremely comfortable to wear but are not offered to men.

Edited March 2, 2018 by Cali

[Shyheels]

Who says I am waiting? One can find menswear in more interesting colours, but it takes some looking. I look. I find. I just wish it were more generally available, and accepted that men might want to have a broader selection of colours available - and, where available, that not all of those colours being solely at the fast/violent/ red-orange end of the spectrum. It is such tedious stereotyping...

Edited March 4, 2018 by Shyheels

[Cali]

Hunter green, purple, deep blue, lavender, heather grey, navy blue, .....

If you can expand your horizon you'll see there is so much more available.

Be vibrant, not stereotyped by the masses.

[Shyheels]

14 minutes ago, Cali said:

Hunter green, purple, deep blue, lavender, heather grey, navy blue, .....

If you can expand your horizon you'll see there is so much more available.

Be vibrant, not stereotyped by the masses.

Er...yes. And that is exactly what I do, but I don't  need to look in the women's section to do it. As I say one can find things, it is just that one has to look around more. It would be nice if one didn't have to.  But in the realm of high-end fashionable cycling gear it is all readily available. 

[HappyinHeels]

JeffB,

You didn't get to where you are by cutting corners and that's the trend which has swept the US and much of the world. A blouse instead of a t-shirt saying "I'm with Stupid", a pair of slacks or nicely pressed jeans instead of jeans with obvious holes and stains, a pair of nice heels instead of flip-flops. This is what you, JeffB, bring to the table. Your outfits show thought which requires effort instead of just whipping on anything laying around. You'll see more well-dressed people in the downtown areas of large cities and you may cause some more people to give more thought to dressing better. Do not lower your standards rather allow others to rise to yours!

RonC,

I realize you are a more stealth creature and you'll only do what is in your comfort zone but you'll find the urge to venture further out as it is the only way to more completely enjoy the heel experience. So few of us shop or meet each other so we need to exude our own confidence as we go out and about...alone. What I've seen you have good taste in shoes. More conservative than me but good taste nevertheless. Operate from that standpoint.

All,

I tend to blend clothing. A pair of androgynous bootcut jeans with no obvious pocket embellishments, a unisex sweater in cooler months or a brightly-colored polo shirt, a woman's style watch, some wedge sandals with polished toes and possibly a handbag. This setup seems to give me what I want yet causes no stir anywhere. I have a slight moustache but no beard. I have, on occasion, done the whole thing from different wigs, to makeup, nails, a dress, and party heels in the 6-8" range. An outdoor wedding where the host requested I come as my more colorful and feminine self. A spring floral dress and matching 5" wedge sandals worked well for that. Some years ago when I met Steve63130 and his lovely wife I gave some thought as to where I was and with whom I was and dressed accordingly. I felt good and welcome and didn't embarrass them nor cause a  stir in their town. What was always a constant though, and I believe this is the power behind JeffB's success, and others here, is the sense of confidence I had and still have. It is the strength one feels when they can look up when once they looked down. The strength when a black seamstress can stay seated in the middle of the bus when once she had to sit in the back. The strength one feels when they can love and cuddle with whom they want when once they had to hide in fear. These are not left values or progressive ideas rather these are basic tenets of human dignity and common sense. But one has to believe to the core in what they are doing and presenting and the world will meet you at eye level. Just what you wanted all along. Equality is there for the taking but you must insist on your seat at the table. And that's the way I see it in this 1600th post.    HappyinHeels

[Shyheels]

I still do not understand this heavy emphasis on wearing women's clothing as the only possible attire that could be worn adequately with heels or boots - especially on a site that is not meant to be about cross dressing. Taking the example quoted above, a vast range of options exist between a women's blouse and a T-shirt that reads "I'm with Stupid".  It is not a matter of either/or. I am all for people wearing whatever they like, but there is no reason boots and heels cannot be worn stylishly and acceptably with menswear.  

Edited March 2, 2018 by Shyheels

[Pierre1961]

@Shyheels I totally agree with you. 

I wear men Levi's 511 with boots,Oxfords and pumps. Men shirts or T shirts. Perfect match for me. 

I agree: i am not so crazy with too much colorful things. Maybe that why I am happy with it can be found in men stores 

it is very interesting to share our tastes.Some members pictures sometimes show amazing outfits I am a bit jealous  

 

[Cali]

I don't have an emphasis on wearing women's clothes. I have an emphasis on wearing the best clothes I can.

Shyheels why do you wear women's boots instead of searching for a manufacture that sells something that has a "Men's label in it. Probably because those "woman's" boots function better. Do you feel that they make you look like a woman? I doubt it.

If a manufacture makes two very similar items, just one has a bit of elastic in it. If one item fits better and performs better, then why should I reject that item because it has a women's label on it?  I don't have the time or desire to want to spend it sourcing a manufacturer that will put a "Men's" label on a similar item.

Just because an item came with a label that says Women's doesn't mean you look like a woman when you wear it. I've had men ask me where I bought something because they wanted one too and I just tell them it something I got years ago.

Clothes don't make the man.  Too many people hide behind their "uniform."

 

BTW those "I'm with Stupid" T-shirts come in both Men's and Women's.

[Shyheels]

You might not personally have a fixation on wearing women’s clothes but even the most cursory reading of many of the threads here, as well as a run down of the topics listed here in the general fashion forum, suggests an overwhelming emphasis on men wearing women’s clothes by members of HHP.

I think everyone here agrees that we should all have the freedom to express ourselves and wear what we like, and indeed the very notion of men wearing high heels implies a certain liberated view on fashion, but I simply don’t understand how or why virtually all discussion of fashions here is centred on men wearing women’s clothes - jeans, dresses, skirts, gowns, sweaters, blouses, pantyhose, handbags, fake nails, make up. 

You mention boots and suggest that I must be wearing women’s boots and assume that I have chosen to do so because I have decided that women’s boots function better than the male counterparts. This is not true, not for me anyway, and on a couple of counts.

For the most part I wear men’s hiking boots. In the main those boots that I wear that are different from the usual run of men’s boots are, in point of fact suede otk boots with flat/low heels, made by Jean Gaborit and come from their men’s/unisex collection. Worn with jeans, shirt, and a jumper or fleece.

I do have stiletto boots. I did not buy them because they are women’s boots, or because women’s stilettos are better than men’s stilettos, but because I liked the aesthetic and they are what they are. I wear them with jeans, shirt and a jumper - all quite masculine. Can be done.

I am not trying to be proscriptive but I just find it a bit far fetched  that all the discussion should centre on women’s clothes, and almost the entirety of men’s clothing dismissed out of hand. As I have said earlier, if people want to normalise the wearing of heels by men, this forum offers a great opportunity to do it by simply making an effort to sell the idea in a way that would be palatable to the vast majority of men who might quietly fancy a pair of heels. A lost opportunity.

 

Edited March 4, 2018 by Shyheels

[Steve63130]

For some guys like me, wearing women's shoes is just the start of the slippery slope. We also wear other women's clothing, but not necessarily ONLY women's clothing. Like you, Shyheels, I wear what looks good on me in my opinion (and that of my wife - very important!). Like you, Cali, if what I think looks good on me comes from the women's side of the store, I don't consider it a problem. I do have to laugh at the whole notion of marketing clothing to one gender or another when it could very well be unisex. Jeans, turtlenecks, t-shirts, leggings - what difference does it make, except for sizing? The thing that gives me a real chuckle is that my company (www.glieberman.com) sells tights, pantyhose, and stockings - traditionally women's hosiery in the 20th century - to men, in men's sizes, and made for men's anatomy. I prefer wearing them to wearing women's hosiery because they're more comfortable. To the rest of the world, they look like women's clothing but they're not. My jeans and turtlenecks don't look like women's clothing but they ARE. Go figure.

Steve 

[Shyheels]

Which gets back to my original query. Why is men’s clothing, or any outfits or assemblages based on men’s clothing, almost never discussed on this forum? Why is the discussion almost exclusively about wearing women’s apparel and accessories?

Edited March 2, 2018 by Shyheels

[Cali]

I started to wear women's shoes (before going to 4 inches) because I finally found shoes that fit. I wear men's jeans and pants because they function better. But when you talk foot wear you also need to talk about hose/socks (I like knee highs for fit) and pants/leggings...Pants tucked in or over, length.... shorts....

For those, like me, that wear open toe sandals in the summer, what are you doing to present a good looking foot with those sandals. Socks with sandals just won't do around here, you'll get laugh at.

Why do you consider nail polish only under women's domain?

[Shyheels]

I was kind of hoping someone might address my question rather than ask me a question about nail polish. 

But I will answer yours. Why would I assign nail polish to the women's section? Well, me and the world, I guess. I think most people - in fact, the overwhelming majority - would place nail polish in the woman's section. Certainly that would be where you would find it in any department store I've ever been in...

Now, about my question: Why is men's clothing almost never discussed on this forum? Why is every discussion about fashion here almost exclusively about men wearing women's apparel and accessories? It's a serious question. 

Edited March 3, 2018 by Shyheels

[Pierre1961]

Yes. That's the serious question. 

The men fashion possibilities are not so many. And we all know everything about it. 

So it is normal that it comes naturally to women clothes when we want to bring any fun in our clothes 

i personally never wear any women clothes. Only heels and belts and corsets. 

The figure is more important than the colors. As I want to look as a man despite of the heels and knowing the accepted codes,women clothes are not an option. Some members here are wearing women clothes perfectly and show that they have a perfect taste.A better one than many women. But for me then it's not only high heels  but just  pure fashion.

Maybe the question is: is that site a fashion ( male or female) or high heels site? 

Or a different way: do we have to discuss about the best clothes to  match the shoes or the nicest shoes to match the dresses ? 

I hope that my poor English is understandable and that it doesn't seem too rude.

[Shyheels]

I beg to differ about their not being so many possibilities with men’s fashion, still less that we all know everything about it. It would seem to me that the field of men’s fashion, coupled with heels, is virtually unexplored territory, ripe for discovery and discussion. 

Any by the way, my compliments on your English which is quite good (alas, far better than my rusty old French) and seems perfectly polite! 

[Pierre1961]

Thank you @Shyheels for your gentle words. 

I may don't have enough imagination. Or it is difficult to get rid of my old habits. We may are used to the image the mirror gives and afraid of any change? 

Yesterday i went to a special cowboys ( and cowgirls) store. I am currently in the US

I bought 2 pairs of Wrangler jean 517 Levi's style.It was impossible for me to find the sizes i wanted in Europe. 

They are slim at the tight and a little boot cut.As the right size was only available in  black color,the improvement isn't so big so far! 

But it will give me that slender figure I am searching  with 4" and 5" heels 

 

 

[Shyheels]

I think you are onto something when you say the mirror gives one a jarring image. We are not used to seeing men in heels and since the image is jarring, and it is human nature not to like being jarred, we tend to think there is something ‘wrong’ when what we really mean is ‘unfamiliar’. 

If the image of a masculine guy in heels became more familiar it would cease to jar, and the overall look would be recognised for what it us, or can be, stylish and masculine.

[Pierre1961]

Totally right! 

[Steve63130]

I agree with you, Shyheels. It's natural to want to avoid jarring images, but we would get used to anything if we see it often enough. 30 years ago men wearing earrings were a jarring image, yet men have worn earrings since ancient times, just not recently. It was a jarring image at first. We've all gotten used to it by seeing it so frequently that it's no longer jarring. In some places it's almost the norm! So we tend not to notice it anymore because it's so common.

I would like to suggest that you start a thread in the For the Guys section which focuses on what fashion apparel intended for or marketed to men, guys like to wear (and think look good with) their heels. In the first post you can define the parameters of what you want to see in the thread and others can contribute from there. It could be interesting.

Steve

[Shyheels]

Hi Steve - I was thinking I might do just that. As you say, it could be interesting.  I believe this forum could actually be an agent for change, in however modest  a way. 

Edited March 3, 2018 by Shyheels

[Cali]

Steve brings up an interesting concept here with earrings. Thirty years ago earrings were almost exclusive worn by women. Yet now they are almost unisex. If you go looking for earrings in a department store you will find them more often than not in the women's section. I see nail polish in the same way, 10-20 years from now it might be unisex. it's certainly more popular among men than 15-20 years ago. (I using nail polish as an example, because I fell if you wear open toe heels you almost have to color your toes.)

One thing you might want to explore is how much of your heel do you expose below your pants.

Edited March 3, 2018 by Cali

[Shyheels]

Twenty years from now we might all be wearing sarongs or dressing like the Jetsons - anything is possible. Nevertheless I would say nail polish for men is most unlikely to be widely seen or accepted any time in the foreseeable future. What are the drivers for change? Why would nail polish for men be widely adopted or become fashionable? What is going to make it popular? Fashionable? How? And why?

Think about it. What would be the percentage right now of men in the population who paint their nails? A tiny, tiny, tiny fraction of one percent - maybe. I travel all over the world and I have never personally met or seen one. Even if you doubled that, thereby allowing yourself to claim a 100% jump in the number of men who paint their nails, you would still be left with a tiny, tiny, fraction of one percent of the population.  

Edited March 3, 2018 by Shyheels

[Pierre1961]

About 30 years ago earring for men started to be seen. But it was more or less considered as a sign of being a  bad guys,weirdo or what ever more or less negative. But never assimilated to the gay community or cross dressing . Similar as tattoos in the same period  

Then people got used to it and now no one cares 

High heels, painted nails are considered as 

a women private field. 

I hope it could follow the same way but I doubt because high heels gives more or less a fragile feeling as well as painted nails need a lot of work to be perfect  

a man is supposed to leave the bathroom within 10 minutes every morning  

A woman can stay for 1 hour and it’s normal 

 

 

[Shyheels]

Yes, the time element. Do you seriously see a lot of men taking time each morning  to paint their nails? Seriously?

What aspect of society do you see as a pointer towards men taking all this extra time - or indeed any extra time - preparing themselves to go out and greet the day? 

And which men? Construction workers? Factory workers? Tradesmen? The military? Police? Fire and rescue? Gardeners and landscapers? Quantity surveyors? Field geologists? Roughnecks on oil rigs? Who is going to be doing this?

Edited March 3, 2018 by Shyheels

[MackyHeels]

3 hours ago, Shyheels said:

Twenty years from now we might all be wearing sarongs or dressing like the Jetsons - anything is possible. Nevertheless I would say nail polish for men is most unlikely to be widely seen or accepted any time in the foreseeable future. What are the drivers for change? Why would nail polish for men be widely adopted or become fashionable? What is going to make it popular? Fashionable? How? And why?

Think about it. What would be the percentage right now of men in the population who paint their nails? A tiny, tiny, tiny fraction of one percent - maybe. I travel all over the world and I have never personally met or seen one. Even if you doubled that, thereby allowing yourself to claim a 100% jump in the number of men who paint their nails, you would still be left with a tiny, tiny, fraction of one percent of the population.  

It's not always a style or trend makes someone want to paint their nails.  Think it's the shoe your wearing such as peep toe sandal-wedge, flats, heels woman wear as the weather becomes warmer, exposing their feet. Women tend to want to look their best and find it cute to accent their toenails just like tying ribbon around there hair. We all tend to stare at ourselves especially our feet either enjoying what we see or try to improve on what we may find more fun. Bet woman paint toenails less in winter months only because they cover them in footwear not looking at them. When spring, summer months arrive they begin to get pedicures at salons making their feet prettier, softer from bunions, calluses, dryness  ready to wear there open toe sandal, peep toe heels etc..  

If men want to wear same exact open style footwear as woman in warmer months they need to maintain their feet a little better. Get rid of dead dried chapped skin, and yes pedicure there toenails. Doesn't mean they need to paint them but while there grooming themselves then why not paint them and try various colours doing it. Only thing i can say is men who have time on there hands grooming, may paint their toenails and very few people would notice if they wear covered footwear.  Always give similar analogy how many men wear thong underwear. We only can take sales reports of thongs and the market for such niche group. Yet no one really knows because men can buy female thongs and sales statistics only assume it's worn for a woman same as heels or any other piece of clothing, scarf, hat, socks, hoisery etc...

Now for the topic at hand woman or stores selling heels market specialty shoes for occasions.  For example a stiletto pump court platform shoe is often considered a type of shoe for a prom, office, wedding heel, rather then casual shoe to be going to the mall. Anyone wearing such heels will look odd and yes labeled as overdressed she is walking along doing everyday activities.

People are herded into a style that best suits occasions or type.  Maybe a marketing ploy  developed to make woman buy many shoes for specific outing. Or it could be just following a trend that vast majority of  woman agree on. So when woman is out to a baseball game she may wear a strappy open toe heel or wedge with casual outfit. If she dared to be bold wearing office outfit skirt jacket and heel court pumps it may look way to formal  or dressy and be observed as out of sorts, people grinning, smirking, snarky comments made upon her, "thinks she's at church or going to a wedding" etc..

Nobody wants to be criticized or mocked especially woman on there outfits. So they wear what others are in the surrounding they are spending some hours in. Often i observe woman knowing they want to look sexy, using there heels they never worn for long time for that occasional night out, dressed semi-casual yet feel awkward or uncomfortable wearing poor ill fitting heels. Seeing them taking their heels off there feet as they sit or comments made their feet hurt red in getting blisters or pain in some uncomfortable dressy footwear. 

Although do understand the desire wearing specific heels yet i'm aware that the shoes might be to much or over dressed for that outing. Only when i see woman wearing some heels it becomes more comfortable in the outing . Yet when i do see a single woman wearing her heels in face of many who don't, she often has a smile on her face loving the way she is outfitted. Or that she sees people staring at her or me for that matter, thinking to herself that guy is checking me out, woe!  Little does she know i'm checking out her heels or outfit approving of the appearance wishing more woman would wear. Yet many women don't care what people think of them in there casual outfits thus uggs are worn or flat sneakers. They believe i got heels at home don't need to kill my feet wearing in the mall shopping or walking around.  Or there black legging outfit they have on finding it all to comfortable and blends in with every woman around. Funny how most women are shopping for something unique that nobody wears. Yet they attire themselves exactly the same on casual outing or yoga class don't know which is it anymore.Something has to be said of a well dressed person walking in well lit public place such as a mall. While many do the opposite dress-up in darkly lit evening night club where few select people may even notice a colour let alone texture or your shoes.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 3, 2018 by MackyHeels