Firefox Posted September 23, 2003 Posted September 23, 2003 I think its so cool that a guy can wear nice female clothes and be so open about it. I just can't stand males who pretend to be females on this forum - and you know who you are 'hon'! That was a quote from Becky in another thread. How do you approach the subject? For my part, the reason I come to this forum is to share views with other intelligent people interested in shoes, fashion ideas, and high heels in all their various guises. Those people could be females, males, or as our host Jeff says "somewhere in between". So it doesn't matter to me in what category they happen to fall into, and if they post in another category then it still doesn't matter. I personally am not looking for any sexual titilation here though if I was, I would undoubtably wanting to hear from genuine females and hence be frustrated if people were pretending. Of course that is a male perspective. I can't answer or explain from Becky's viewpoint. But enough of my ideas. What do you think? Does it it matter? And if it does, why does it matter? Be honest.
hoverfly Posted September 23, 2003 Posted September 23, 2003 Well, I am a man who just wears high heels and in public certain stiles of high heel boots. I not faking it, I am who I am. However the number of claimes on this forum are questionable, but I give all the benefit of the doubt. Hello,  my name is Hoverfly. I’m a high heel addict…. Weeeeeeeeeee!  👠1998 to 2022!
Bubba136 Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Hoverfly wrote:Well, I am a man who just wears high heels and in public certain styles of high heel boots. I not faking it, I am who I am Same here, hoverfly. And, I really don't care if anyone believes me or or not. I've actually nothing to gain by being something other than "me." I know for certain that one or two posters here actually are putting on "a front" by reacting in ingenious ways or claiming to be "what they aren't." However, as Sasha used to say, "This is the Internet. It's entertainment." Anyone can be anybody or anything they want to be. So, don't be surprised if impressions presented aren't real. Yes, IMO, it would help if people admitted to their "real" sex. Because thinking of their comments based on actual" gender gained knowledge" is, in most cases, important and their thoughts and experiences could be viewed in their true context because most people registered here are serious about this subject. Firefox and those that accompany him on his "heelmeets" have a large advantage over the rest of us. They have actually met face to face and have no doubt that they are who they say they are. But, in the final analysis, it's a great big "Who cares" -- either participate or don't . There's always other websites to view. Being mentally comfortable in your own mind is the key to wearing heels in public.
stilettos Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 I don't think Guys should pretend to be Gals in the For the Gals Forum and vice-versa in the For the Guys Forum. But it's hardly a serious offence, it would just be nice if the reason the forums are so named was respected...
sscotty727 Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 I will echo the sentiment that depends on what you are looking for. I didn't join this group to romantically meet anyone. I mainly joined the group for street-heeling advice and courage/support to overcome my nervousness. The only area I can see where gender matters is a guy can give you insight in the emotions to overcome buying/wearing heels in public, however both genders (and those in between) can give you advice on perceptions of men wearing heels in public, so I view all as invaluable. Scotty
Highluc Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Yes, IMO, it would help if people admitted to their "real" sex. Because thinking of their comments based on actual" gender gained knowledge" is, in most cases, important and their thoughts and experiences could be viewed in their true context because most people registered here are serious about this subject. Firefox and those that accompany him on his "heelmeets" have a large advantage over the rest of us. They have actually met face to face and have no doubt that they are who they say they are. What is somebodies real sex? The one somebody assigned to you after a quick glance at some outside secondary sex characteristics during birth, or the one imbedded in the brains? Luckily for most both match but for a small percentage of humans there is a dysphorie which can go from minimal (preference for heels?) to totaly opposite (sex reassignment surgery), and all the forms in between. Are those people lying then? I've been to a few heelmeets but I doubt any participant saw through me at that moment (even I was still discovering myself at the age of 50). After a few decades you become a master in playing roles to suit society, but am I a lesser person because of all this? Am I pretending? My parents pretend they have a boy who will die like a man but nothing is for sure in this world anymore. At least some of us get the chance to be themselves, without having to pretend to be who they aren't. Be youself, enjoy any footwear you like and don't care about what others think about it, it's your life, not theirs. Greetings from Laurence
Bubba136 Posted September 25, 2003 Posted September 25, 2003 Highluc, why would you ever think that I would believe you were less of a man because you chose to live your life in the manner you've chosen? I really don't think you understand my point. Now, without getting all wrapped up and emotional about the "in-betweens" -- because we all know that phycologically there are more than two sexes -- recognizing and understanding that is a "given." And, I'm sure you understand perfectly well where my comments were heading without my detailing it. I fail to see, however, why you chose to vector them in a direction I didn't intend. Perhaps it was to remind me that there are differences and that you are different and, perhaps, to justify your own situation -- which is totally unnecessary. I really don't know. Its a fact, isn't it, that in today's "society" high heels are made for women and not for men? The fact that it took you more than half of the 20th century to "discover" your true identity doesn't alter the fact that, as you say, if you have a "ding-a-ling" society (and your parents) will classify you as male. To me, the value to knowing that the person doing the "describing" is really a female, puts their comments concerning the way they dress in a totally different "experience plane" and context than it would be if the individual was a male, TS or TV. I'm not suggesting that their comments are be any less appropriate or true, but their observations would be based on a completely different set of life circumstances and reasons for wearing the clothing they chose. Debbie describing her experiences wearing heels is totally different than me describing mine. You describing your experiences is also different than mine. Because, no matter how we might try, we can only comment on from the point of wearing heels as men. And, even though a man dresses as a women, they still can't describe their experiences "as being women." Because they are not women. That's my whole point. And that is my opinion.............. Being mentally comfortable in your own mind is the key to wearing heels in public.
Heelfan Posted September 25, 2003 Posted September 25, 2003 Yes, I thoroughly agree with Bubba. As usual, he talks a lot of sense. This 'pretending' subject came up recently when forum member High Surprise participated in Firefox's 'Let's Get to Know Each Other' survey thread as a male, and shortly afterwards began posting as a female. In my opinion it is much more meaningful to us all if each poster is honest, and tells us their born sex. That way we can identify with their experiences, adventures, heel-and-clothes-wearing etc. from a true perspective. That's all very easy for me to say as a straight, heterosexual heel-wearing guy, but I am sure it gets much more complicated, confusing and bewildering for those who feel themselves changing into the opposite sex, or hovering in between, or even tasking the plunge with a sex-change operation. But, I think the point is that NONE OF THAT IS ANYTHING TO BE ASHAMED OF! and in fact, I think it would elicit every understanding from the usual people on these forums, because I am sure that the vast majority of us heel-wearing guys must query and try to analyse our own sexual orientations from time to time. Therefore, why can't everyone just be honest about their born sex, and equally honest if that has now started to drift in the opposite direction. Far from alienating the reader, I am pretty sure that it will foster greater interest, trust and support from everyone if we know each other's true history and status. Highluc recently posted his opinion that each heel-wearer's sex is irrelevant, and that he simply admires heels as works of art etc. Well, Highluc, I suggest that your own stories contradict that notion completely. I found your 'Poor Boy' story to be very sexually stimulating, as when his sister helps him buy a pair of 4" loafers as his regular school shoes. Now, Luc, you must admit that had that been 'Poor girl' intead of 'Poor Boy', the cross-dressing interest would have been totally absent and the average reader would just say 'So what' and switch off. Therefore I repeat my earlier point on another thread - member's postings mean MUCH more to me if the reader can correctly identify with the writer in the knowledge that they were born as a male, or as a female. It gives hugely more meaning to every little experience and anecdote. And, as I have already said above, I cannot see any reason for everyone to be anything other than frank and honest about themselves, including any sexual re-orientation, and this can only bring enhanced respect and appreciation from the readers. Cheerfully yours, Heelfan Onwards and upwards!
Yamyam Posted September 26, 2003 Posted September 26, 2003 As I've said here before, I don't think gender is that well defined. I'm happy being me, and I respect others being themselves. One of the wonderful things about the Internet is that you can talk to people, exchange views, hopes, fears, and a lot more besides, without unnecessary details of your body necessarily being involved. I don't think it matters what bits people were born with, it matters how they interact with you. So, on that basis, and in my opinion at least, let's leave it to individuals to decide if, how, and when they decide to reveal their gender. As long as people are making sensible contributions, then all of those contributions should be welcomed and valued. Let's keep welcoming, valuing and learning. Oh, and I generally stay out of posting in the 'For Women' section of the forum, as I think that it's defined as a place for those people who call themselves women. But I value everyone's contributions everywhere. Obsessed is such a strong word. I prefer to think of myself as "differently enthusiastic"
Laurieheels Posted September 26, 2003 Posted September 26, 2003 This is the internet. People live out fantasy here as much as anything, don't they? In a way, it's like an extension of trying to play the sims. My sister's cmoputer has the Sims, I made a character that is a lot like me. others may make someone totally different from who they are. People are free to present themselves in whatever way they would like in society or on the internet. Fear and other things may limit this to the internet. If no one is being hurt, and people are happy, then who cares?????? My only advice is that a person look inside, find something about his or her true self, and true desires, and live that life. Male living like a female a lot in private? Enjoying the dressing up and doing it as often as possible? Then perhaps something of the true self is being hidden for fear of something. But, that is how that person has chosen to live life. If someone else doesn't like that, well, that's a shame, but, we're all looking for acceptance in our own ways, so that doesn't give anyone the right to say anything about anyone else. Take care of your business in your own home first, before you try to meddle with the neighbours. And that's why I decided I have to be a writer.
Firefox Posted November 12, 2003 Author Posted November 12, 2003 I've read the arguments and thought about them but from my perspective I still don't care about born sex within the context of this particular forum. If someone does, then the primary reason for that is going to be sexual titilation, or as a precursor to a RL relationship, in my view.
PJ Posted November 13, 2003 Posted November 13, 2003 When I first got involved in internet chat, I spent a lot of time in a Crossdresser chat room. Little did I know what a learning experience this would be. I thought gender was a clear cut issue. I used to get offended by crossdressers misrepresenting themselves. But listening over time to these crossdressers exposed me to many lifestyle variations and influences I never considered before. I had no idea just how complex the gender issue can be for some crossdressers. Over time, I came to the following conclusion regarding gender. Unless I am seeking to develop a relationship, it really does not matter what gender they may be. click .... click .... click .... The sensual sound of stiletto heels on a hard surface.
Arctic Posted November 13, 2003 Posted November 13, 2003 I'm of the opinion that misrepresenting oneself is not good for any community, regardless of the goals is pursues. Whether one is male, female or indeed anything in between, either mentally, psychologically or even physically doesn't make any difference to me. An opinion of a man or women, either born or through a transgenderal process, still is an opinion and should be respected. If a person has crossdressing desires (not counting heels), let him/her discuss it on the board (preferably in a designated area). There are probably many interesting things to be said about the subject. It is defenitely not my thing, and luckily for my wallet and for other reasons I do not have any gender identity issues to deal with, but that doesn't make it less valuable for the persons to whom it applies. But, on the other hand, it really pisses me off when a certain person, poses himself as being of the other gender, and is really bad at it, and often even does it in a very offensive way. There are a couple of guys around here who had/have in my opinion very unappealing avatars of them posing half naked in tarty clothes. If people want to do that, that is fine, but then they should stay IN THE FETISH forums: those people have a fetish for misrepresenting themselves and trying to be "sexy". In the eyes of people without such a fetish they are failing miserably at it. Once again, I have no problems at all with people who have a desire for crossdressing, I am even very interested in engaging into discussions with them, but they should be honest and say who they are, and discuss what bothers them. Decent pictures of full crosdressing are perfectly acceptable on this board I would say. But, personally, I am rather not hit in the face with the crossdressing pictures of the OFFENSIVE kind without warning, and although I strongly feel that everyone should be able to do what he or she fancies, there has to be a minimal respect for the rest of society, who might not appreciate having to look at unappealing crossdressers. It's the same thing with porn spam: I have absolutely nothing against adult content on the web, but it has happened to me several times when I am presenting slides in a meeting using a projector, and someone says "I mailed you two slides about this or that, can you please project them?". Then I open my email client, only to see that I have to dig for his email between al the porn, viagra and get rich quick scheme spam. It also has happened once that I clicked by accident on such mails, and I was projecting one a 150" screen porn of the heaviest kind. That does wonders for your credibility! So adult content is fine, but getting it unasked is not. Porn spam is a good example, and offensive pictures of crossdressers in a shoe forum is another. It's not that I am really offended as such by these posts on the board, I really can handle quite something , but it discounts the credibility of the discussions enormously for those people who still need to be convinced that an interest in heels is at least for a large part of us not a sexual deficiency! Before those people started appearing on the board, this board was solely full of high quality discussions between highly intelligent people (men, women and everything in between!) about shoes with high heels. The perfect argument you need to convince your wife for one that there are lots of people with this interest, and for most of them this is not gender problem related! Now I wouldn't dare to suggest such a thing to my wife. It's very easy for a casual observer to think that those gender identity and people desiring to wear high heel shoes go hand in hand, when looking at the board. It's for this reason that I am not anymore actively participating in the discussions. So, my suggestion: represent your true identity on the board. We are discussing shoes here. If you like to discuss your shoe fetish and gender problem linked together, please do so in the fetish forum, it's there for a reason. If you are a man and want to talk as a naughty girl, please do so in the fetish forum too. Indecent pictures and so on should be banned from the mainstream board. Wearing high heeled shoes is nothing to be ashamed of, also not as a man. I wish I could let my hypothetical 10 year old kids read this forum, because wearing heels is just something that people do. Now I couldn't, because people are not willing to separate the heelwearing from the sexual issue. Just my 2 cents... What's all the fuss about?
Heelfan Posted November 13, 2003 Posted November 13, 2003 Bert - an extremely good posting, if I might say so! I totally agree with your two messages: 1. Whether you are 100% male or 100% female, or somewhere in between, why not be honest about it? It's the only way of benefitting from truly frank and sincere discussion. 2. Don't be offensive along the way. Bravo! Cheerfully yours, Heelfan Onwards and upwards!
Firefox Posted November 13, 2003 Author Posted November 13, 2003 While I disagree with Bert about the need of representing your true identity, I do agree with him about the indecent type of crossdressing photos in the regular forums. Some of the pictures I have seen have been of a bare arse with a leather thong or similar. This type of thing is not acceptable public behaviour by male or female, and should be reserved for the fetish forum. It is a far cry from a genuine interest in shoe fashion, worn in a respectable way in public by either gender, to posts about bras over heads or seeing cum on hose, or links to a gay men in panties website, all of which I have either had to delete or move to the fetish forum.
Heelfan Posted November 14, 2003 Posted November 14, 2003 Bravo to Firefox's rebuttel of unnecessary lewdness. That's not what this site is here for. There are other sites for nudity, porn, etc. Cheerfully yours, Heelfan Onwards and upwards!
azraelle Posted November 16, 2003 Posted November 16, 2003 Bert, Firefox, DITTO. "All that you can decide, is what to do with the time that is given you."--Gandalf, "Life is not tried, it is merely survived -If you're standing outside the fire."--Garth Brooks
dressboots Posted July 3, 2004 Posted July 3, 2004 I am a man who likes feminine heeled boots, period. The inclusion of lewd photos in regular discussion boards discredits the site if one like me is to attempt to use this site to show that wearing high heels is not a sexual turn for all, but just a facet of some men like me. I hope no one feels as though I am "pretending." I do not street heel presently but having found this forum has me thinking more seriously on the subject, again of recognizing who I am. I street heeled years ago so can speak with experience if not practicing it now. I believe this forum does more than the active heelers know to help those of us too shy to do so. If living one's fantasies/dreams is a crime then the human race would have gone nowhere. Seeing the examples of others is inspirational to those of us who are only spectators at this juncture. classic style high heel boots
shyguy Posted July 3, 2004 Posted July 3, 2004 Dress boots said I believe this forum does more than the active heelers know to help those of us too shy to do so I agree with that, without seeing the other guys here who regularly streetheel, I would still be feeling abnormal about my wearing womens shoes and certainly wouldn't now be wearing any outside as I now do. Because of the people who post here, I know it's not that unusual to like heels, and to want to wear them. And on topic I too am only interested in the shoes side of crossdressing and find some of the pics a bit near the mark with regards to nudity. That said though it is up to the board moderators/owners what goes and what stays. And it is up to the individual to find somewhere else they can post what the moderators don't allow here. He was so narrow minded he could see through a keyhole with both eyes. Brown's Law: If the shoe fits, it's ugly
Mickey S. Posted July 3, 2004 Posted July 3, 2004 I don't care if someone's pretending as long as noone else is harmed by the postings... CU! -Mike
genebujold Posted July 4, 2004 Posted July 4, 2004 I would hope that we're all comfortable enough in our sexuality to post in our true gender. Then again, as I lay counselor I can assure you that gender identity doesn't necessarily match whether a person has XX or XY chromosomes... I'm an XY male who lives his life as a male, a husband, and a father. As a male, I wear heels and gender-neutral skirts around the house, and often nondescript heels in public. I'm not hiding anything - I would hope others aren't hiding anything either! Post as your inner heart tells you is the true you.
genebujold Posted July 4, 2004 Posted July 4, 2004 While I disagree with Bert about the need of representing your true identity, I do agree with him about the indecent type of crossdressing photos in the regular forums. Some of the pictures I have seen have been of a bare arse with a leather thong or similar. This type of thing is not acceptable public behaviour by male or female, and should be reserved for the fetish forum. It is a far cry from a genuine interest in shoe fashion, worn in a respectable way in public by either gender, to posts about bras over heads or seeing cum on hose, or links to a gay men in panties website, all of which I have either had to delete or move to the fetish forum. I like the "delete" option the best, as this board can easily be viewed by minors.
bladerunner Posted August 18, 2004 Posted August 18, 2004 Well after a good read i have to agree with Bert,be who you want to be but there is a rightful place for everything.If you want fetish conversations/pictures we all know where to look i don't expect it to turn up where its not needed or wanted.Keep up with the good work moderators. I just love those suede heels!!!!!
Dawn HH Posted August 20, 2004 Posted August 20, 2004 Bladerunner:-) I whole-heartedly agree with your last post. With me I don't pretend or hide anything, (except my heels when street-heeling). With me, what you get is what you get. Even though I am an avid poster, everything that I have posted is 100% true. I don't particularly care for pretenders or someone trying to hide something, or someone trying to deceive anyone. Cheers--- Dawn HH High Heeled Boots Forever!
jmc Posted August 20, 2004 Posted August 20, 2004 Interesting thread, and food for lots of thought. . .here's my two cents' worth: First, I find it to be easier to just be yourself. Don't put up a pretense because as soon as you do, you must buffer all your reactions through that pretense. As soon as you let that buffer lapse, even inadvertently, you create an inconsistency. Life is complicated enough without having to do all that mental processing. With that in mind I'm a guy who occasionally likes the feeling of a pair of heeled shoes or boots on his feet. Maybe not all the time and maybe not the extreme heights that cause pain and require extensive training but a nice pair three or four inchers. I like the feeling so much that I've gone out into the Real World in them. But here's the rub -- by the norms of society, heels are supposed to be for women. Not that there's any anatomical differences between the male and female foot but that's the way things are. It's an arbitrary situation and it has been discussed in length, breadth, and depth elsewhere on this board but that's reality. I also like heels on women. (I like women without heels too but a high heel imparts an extra measure of intrigue and beauty to any woman.) In fact, after looking at Gina's pictures in another thread on this board, I believe the ladies really have nothing to worry about from us guys. No matter what we wear nor how well we wear it, we'll never approach the level of grace, beauty and elegance that is part of a real lady's nature. (I know, I'm digressing.) So I come here because I find people who share some of my views. Occasionally I find material here that bolsters my confidence to go out in heels -- and I can truly say that I have never regretted doing that. Were I in search of sexual tittillation, there are at least 1 x 10^9 other places I can go on the Internet to take care of my desires in a click. As a male heel enthusiast, I must keep my judgementalism under control. "Judge not lest thee be judged." So I am trying to work on open-mindedness, realizing that there are other people here who have different desires. So I pick and choose what I read here and what I take to heart, value -- like beauty -- is in the eye of the beholder. Have a happy time!
genebujold Posted August 20, 2004 Posted August 20, 2004 Wow - good post, JMC, especially the part about "First, I find it to be easier to just be yourself. Don't put up a pretense because as soon as you do, you must buffer all your reactions through that pretense. As soon as you let that buffer lapse, even inadvertently, you create an inconsistency. Life is complicated enough without having to do all that mental processing." So true. Telling the truth is always better, not only for others, but for yourself, as well. Lying=dying=immaturity Truth=growth=maturity
Dawn HH Posted August 22, 2004 Posted August 22, 2004 Jmc:-) What a great, great and down-to-earth post. What you and Gene both say is quite true. That's me---take me as I am. If I told even a little lie, I'd be the first one to get caught. Each lie you tell makes the next lie told even bigger in order to cover up the first one. It's like digging a hole in sand. One shovel out and then 2 more fall in. Cheers--- Dawn HH High Heeled Boots Forever!
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