Blockchain Revolution: from the internet of information to the internet of value

[at9]

At the moment it rather looks like others are being greedy. And there's very public encouragement for others to be greedy too, judging by the adverts in the press and elsewhere.

[Shyheels]

Indeed. Buffets are the very words I think of when I see advertisements for crypto currencies promising returns of 2000%

Edited November 27, 2017 by Shyheels

[kneehighs]

56 minutes ago, at9 said:

At the moment it rather looks like others are being greedy. And there's very public encouragement for others to be greedy too, judging by the adverts in the press and elsewhere.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/21/finance-chiefs-say-bitcoin-is-real-but-many-think-its-in-a-bubble-right-now.html

"Ninety-seven chief financial officers (CFOs) on CNBC's Global CFO Council were asked their view on bitcoin. Out of the 43 that responded, 27.9 percent said the cryptocurrency is "real but in a bubble." Another 14 percent said that bitcoin is "real and still going higher."

Meanwhile, 27.9 percent said bitcoin is a "fraud" while 30.2 percent of CFOs said they don't know enough about the digital currency to have an opinion.

A third of respondents in EMEA also think bitcoin is a "fraud," higher than their counterparts in the other regions across the world."

Again, it all depends on your risk profile.  Are you an investor, a swing trader, a day trader?  If you had put a limit order in for 500 pounds of POWR on the 13th when I mentioned it here, you'd be up over 600%.  Your Mileage May Vary though.  

Edited November 27, 2017 by kneehighs

[at9]

2 bits of wisdom:

 

Past performance is no guide to future returns.

Don't wager more than you can afford to lose.

[Shyheels]

Words of wisdom indeed!

So many of the advertisements I see for cryptocurrencies read just like pitches for pyramid selling. 

Ponzi schemes are great - if you are one of the early adopters. There are plenty of people who made some very good returns from Bernie Madoff's investment house. The late comers didn't fare so well.  

[kneehighs]

Nothing talked about in any post here hasn't already been expressed in one shape or another.  

1. Find a strategy that works for you.  I've repeated this many times here.   Investor?  Swing trader?  Day Trader?  What's your risk tolerance profile.  Find your edge.
2. Mental discipline.  You can never know what will happen next in the market no matter how strong your analytical skills are or how convinced you are about the anticipated move. Thus always define risk before entry and stick to it

 

EDIT: I started this conversation around the value of blockchain technology first so people wouldn't get in a hysteria about BitCoin.  

Edited November 28, 2017 by kneehighs

[Heelster]

5 hours ago, kneehighs said:

1. Find a strategy that works for you.  I've repeated this many times here.   Investor?  Swing trader?  Day Trader?  What's your risk tolerance profile.  Find your edge.

My risk tolerance is well defined by my pocket. Spare change.

From what little I've read on Blockchain, its another transactional database variant, so that will be of no real interest to myself as I tend to avoid excessive use of the internet for this kind of function. I've been around the digital world long before the internet arrived, and I;m still wary of financial transactions online. Mail me my paycheck and I'll gladly escort it to the bank. (It's to small to go on it's own)

[kneehighs]

3 hours ago, Heelster said:

My risk tolerance is well defined by my pocket. Spare change.

From what little I've read on Blockchain, its another transactional database variant, so that will be of no real interest to myself as I tend to avoid excessive use of the internet for this kind of function. I've been around the digital world long before the internet arrived, and I;m still wary of financial transactions online. Mail me my paycheck and I'll gladly escort it to the bank. (It's to small to go on it's own)

https://coinflashapp.com/

I haven't done my due diligence on this, but will when I get a chance.  It automatically converts your "spare change" into crypto. 

[Shyheels]

My spare change usually gets converted into parking time, via a meter. I have not devised a great acronym yet to describe this conversion, but I am working on it. 

[Cali]

1 hour ago, Shyheels said:

I have not devised a great acronym yet to describe this conversion, but I am working on it. 

That's called RENT.

[kneehighs]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4976528/Notting-Hill-mansion-sale-pay-Bitcoin.html

RENT or million dollar penthouse.

[Shyheels]

There is a house for sale in London of similar price, with Bitcoin only accepted. Unsurprisingly the guy selling it is one of the main promoters of Bitcoin, who purchased the house with some of his early profits and is now apparently using the sale if his property, at a huge profit, to promote Bitcoin. Lots of cross pollination going on. 

[meganiwish]

It makes me think of the canals or the railways.  The second wave of investors all lost.

'Spare' change is money.  None of mine is spare.  Every penny gets used.

[at9]

Martin Lewis is one of the most respected financial commnentators in the UK. His blog post on Bitcoin is worth reading:

https://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/2017/11/30/invest-bitcoin-four-things-need-know/

[Shyheels]

A well thought out comment piece by a well respected financial advisor. Personally I have no interest or intention of buying or investing in Bitcoin.

I see too that it plunged by 20% today. Nothing that volatile can be considered a sensible medium of exchange. It is simply a plaything for speculators.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Shyheels

[Heelster]

On 30/11/2017 at 1:34 PM, Shyheels said:

A well thought out comment piece by a well respected financial advisor. Personally I have no interest or intention of buying or investing in Bitcoin.

I see too that it plunged by 20% today. Nothing that volatile can be considered a sensible medium of exchange. It is simply a plaything for speculators.

I hear North Korea is attempting to acquire as much bitcoin as possible. Hmmmmmm - - 

[Shyheels]

3 hours ago, Heelster said:

I hear North Korea is attempting to acquire as much bitcoin as possible. Hmmmmmm - - 

The perfect currency for evading sanctions 

[meganiwish]

Which makes me think, 'Nutter who's a big fish in a small pond and wants to look to his people that he's a big fish in a big pond.  I really must follow his financial savvy.'

[Shyheels]

A man with a haircut like that indefinitely worth following... 

[Shyheels]

Some thought provoking words by Nobel prize winning economist Robert Shiller who won his Nobel for his work on market bubbles and who believes Bitcoin ought to be outlawed

http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/01/investing/bitcoin-criticism-outlawed/index.html

[at9]

Another article worth reading:

https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22129553-700-bitcoin-how-its-core-technology-will-change-the-world/

[Shyheels]

I'm going with the Nobel Prize winner - I think he's sounding the right gong.

[at9]

There is something approaching a flood of articles in non-specialist publications about Bitcoin. Another:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/dec/03/bitcoin-investors-hoping-billions-sack-fools-gold

One of the themes of these articles is that Bitcoin is currently mainly used for speculation rather than commercial transactions. I know there is a huge amount of speculation in fiat currencies ($$, ££ etc) but we all use them every day as a genuine medium of exchange.

[Shyheels]

But fiat currencies are not exclusively driven by speculators and appear to exist for no other reason. 

[kneehighs]

15 hours ago, Shyheels said:

Some thought provoking words by Nobel prize winning economist Robert Shiller who won his Nobel for his work on market bubbles and who believes Bitcoin ought to be outlawed

http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/01/investing/bitcoin-criticism-outlawed/index.html

1.  Stiglitz MISLEAD people about a false US Government Bitcoin ban back in 2016: http://www.newsbtc.com/2016/09/08/bitcoin-us-ban-joseph-stiglitz/

2.  Fiat currency economists have been arguing this Point of View since 2013: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=392780.msg4232835#msg4232835

3.  What do you want to bet he wanted to buy Bitcoin on a prospective dip in price he thought he could cause?  Reminds me of JP Morgans "bitcoin fraud" with next day ledgers showing JP Morgan's volume in BTC the 4th highest out of any signature address. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-09-16/if-jamie-dimon-hates-it-so-much-then-why-jpmorgan-buying-bitcoin-europe

4.  It doesn't matter what Stiglitz or Shiller think when you are counting your money.

Edited December 5, 2017 by kneehighs

[kneehighs]

8 hours ago, at9 said:

There is something approaching a flood of articles in non-specialist publications about Bitcoin. Another:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/dec/03/bitcoin-investors-hoping-billions-sack-fools-gold

One of the themes of these articles is that Bitcoin is currently mainly used for speculation rather than commercial transactions. I know there is a huge amount of speculation in fiat currencies ($$, ££ etc) but we all use them every day as a genuine medium of exchange.

Yep, it was originally intended as a Medium of Exchange.  https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

I tell my real world friends Crypto is highly speculative.  And when it comes to ICO's, extremely speculative.  

[Shyheels]

It's all very well to say that it doesn't matter what Shiller (an expert in market bubbles) says when you are sitting in your vault, like a goblin, counting your piles of gold but his words might come back to haunt you if/when instead of gloating over your glittering pile you have just lost your shirt because you lost your little all. There are many people who made much money from market bubbles and pyramid schemes - all of them the early adopters who got in and got out before the whole house of cards came crashing down. There are people who made some wonderful returns off Bernie Madoff's schemes too. 

There is a wil-o-the-wisp quality to all this that positively screams 'scam'.  The story changes with the telling and the circumstances - it's a medium of exchange, except when the obvious weaknesses of that are discussed when it transforms itself into an investment; it is a way to provide clarity and transparency in transactions, except when it patently isn't; it is the next big thing on the high street, except that it's leading users seem to be the demimonde, tax evaders, those on the dark web, or rogue states trying to get around sanctions.

And so far no one can point to anything of actual value that is backing these currencies - other than the nebulous collective herd mentality of the internet, and speculators.

         

[kneehighs]

1 hour ago, Shyheels said:

It's all very well to say that it doesn't matter what Shiller (an expert in market bubbles) says when you are sitting in your vault, like a goblin, counting your piles of gold but his words might come back to haunt you if/when instead of gloating over your glittering pile you have just lost your shirt because you lost your little all. There are many people who made much money from market bubbles and pyramid schemes - all of them the early adopters who got in and got out before the whole house of cards came crashing down. There are people who made some wonderful returns off Bernie Madoff's schemes too. 

There is a wil-o-the-wisp quality to all this that positively screams 'scam'.  The story changes with the telling and the circumstances - it's a medium of exchange, except when the obvious weaknesses of that are discussed when it transforms itself into an investment; it is a way to provide clarity and transparency in transactions, except when it patently isn't; it is the next big thing on the high street, except that it's leading users seem to be the demimonde, tax evaders, those on the dark web, or rogue states trying to get around sanctions.

And so far no one can point to anything of actual value that is backing these currencies - other than the nebulous collective herd mentality of the internet, and speculators.

         

 

hahaha, I sincerely laughed out loud at this!  

[Shyheels]

I am a writer, and an absurdist at heart, and  I can't resist playing with words. 

[meganiwish]

I, for one, can spot 'no answer' when no answer exists.