Lies about heel height

[Bubba136]

Daz, from what little I know about Becky, if I were young, single and lived anywhere near her, kinda like you do, I would sure try my best to meet her in person. She used to chat with a bunch of us in Jenny's chat room. And, over the past couple of years, we've gotten to know her pretty well. However, I have a daughter about the same age and they have a lot in common (perhaps it's my paternal instinct?) I can relate to her situation through my experience with my own daughter. She has impressed me with her intelligence, self reliance and determination to meet life head on. The identical qualities I find in my own daughter. And sure, I would like to see her post more often on this forum. she has a great deal to contribute.

[Highluc]

Hey guys come on !!! Is it really so difficult to follow the moderaters request to go back to topic? Why start gossiping about a girls character (good or bad) on a chapter not created for guys doing that, on a completely different topic , just 3 hours after Firefoxes specific request? Some people just never get it or have forgotten such private things can be discussed by private mail, another forum feature. Have a nice weekend, Laurence

[Lucy]

Extremely well said Laurence! After all the earlier kerfuffle, I tried posting on Saturday to respect Vanity by trying to get the thread back on her original topic of girls talking about their heel heights. But what happened? My efforts were swept aside by another avalanche of bickering, egotistical, thick-skinned, heel-wearing guys who appear to have no respect for the moderators, or Vanity, or the rest of us few girls on the board. I despair! As Laurence and the moderator and Heelfan and others are trying to say, PLEASE GIVE US SOME SPACE ON OUR OWN FORUM GUYS! We can't say it any louder than that! Love, Lucy

[Trolldeg]

Something I have noticed is that many lie, or exaggerate the heel height.

Some of my friend say that they don't use their 4" or 5" heels very often,

and when you take a look at them they are 3" or perhaps lower.

I think it's "cute", in some weird way, to pretend that they are higher then they are.

When I shoe-shop together with some friend I encurage her to buy high heels, but they always end up in the closet. Comfort is the key-word.

Sometimes I wonder if it's me that's weird.

Anyone with the same experience?

for some people, the exact heel height maybe isn't that important?

[Highluc]

for some people, the exact heel height maybe isn't that important?

For me the height only comes second to comfort and elegance. I have so many shoes I rarely go shopping for something particular. Usually my eyes fall on a for me overall pleasing model and if the fit is good and the wallet ok I end up buying these. Now as soon as I come home first thing I do is take a ruler and measure the heel and platform if applicable. This is just out of curiosity and even with all my experience I already had some surprises of heels differing up to 1,5cm from my (gu)estimate, both plus or minus. Comfort rarely had any relation to true heel height and I never felt the need to go higher just for the sake of reaching so many inches. By the way, estimating heel heights is not as easy as you thought if you don't know the shoe size you are looking at.

Happy heeling, Laurence

[Anne_Louise]

Bubba, I'm so sorry to have misused your name. The dispute was, of course, between DAZ and Becky. I think a little premature senility must be setting in if I am mixing up names like that! I apologise too for the delay in making this correction. I'm usually very busy at weekends so I rarely have time for forums. Lucy, I agree with every word, and I've had many similar experiences to yours. Anne Louise

[azraelle]

May I offer an alternate viewpoint? Feet is feet, male or female, they're both the same, gender-wise. But not all feet are the same. Some humans have a genetic abnormality (I don't remember the name or technical details, only that it was discussed on this forum some time ago) where heel wearing above, say 1-1/2 inches caused extreme discomfort, which can be alleviated SOMEWHAT by lots of practice, but even "moderate" heels will never really be comfortable. I believe that my mother had this problem. There are other genetic predispositions that make higher heels more comfortable than low heels (or at least as). Flat feet with heel spurs fall into this category, one which I have. I have long known that heel wearing can alleviate pain from knee tendon injuries associated with driving for several hours at a time--again because I have that problem. I recently found that they help a backache, first from posts by genebujold. One of my flatmates was squatting in what to me would be an intensely uncomfortable position right after work. To him it was more comfortable that standing flat-footed because it relieved the pressure on his back to be squatting on his toes. I lent him a pair of relatively low-heeled very ugly block heeled boots (maybe 1-3/4" at the back) to see if it would help--immense relief on both our parts--I got rid of the damn things! More recently, heels helped ME with a backache. My convoluted point is that heels in the range of ~ 1" to 2-1/2" or so are immensely uncomfortable, to me, but heels in the range of 2-3/4" to 4" are more comfortable than most flat shoes, anti-pronation running shoes with double Spenco arched insoles inserted being the sole exception. Maybe some women out there who find what Daz calls low or moderate heels to be excruciating have feet with problems similar to mine, and contrary to what logic would seem to suggest, might find relatively higher heels, especially with a curved arch, to be much more manageable. Most probably never will try them though, because to many women (my ex-wife and oldest daughter come to mind), heels are at best unimportant to their self-image. Why bother?? They don't HAVE to in this day and age, unless they aspire to be exotic dancers or cocktail waitresses, or highly paid models or COMDEX product demonstrators. I also think that most of the "lies" are from predominantly male shoe salesmen, trying to sell sexy shoes to women in shoe stores. They seem to believe that exaggeration of heel height will lead to higher sales. Who knows, maybe they do. But I think that most women who put forth an exaggerated aproximate heel height are just repeating what the salesman (or saleswoman) said--I don't think there are that many that carry a measuring tape with them in their purse to verify the claims. Like I surmise a lot of guys here do.

[Dr. Shoe]

I find that many of the lies about heel height are perpetrated by ebay traders. I was looking at a pair of '5" heels' that were obviously no more than about 3"!

[Firefox]

I'm sure men add the odd inch or two using "poetic licence" when it comes to description of various items. There's no reason women shouldn't do the same

[Arno]

This was supposed to be about lieing about heel height but drifted off course. That is no different than lieing about your age but various other issues came in that I want to comment on. First some sorely needed facts need to be brought into the dispute between Becky and Daz. It is important to know here that high heels that are comfortable to wear must fit well from the beginning. Susan, known from the other forum, was very firm about that and she wore nothing but the highest heels, 24/7. And the critical factor for this is width. Now it so happens that not everyone’s foot has the same width but high heels are made in only one width, called “Medium.” It was previously called “B” because there were then also other widths like A, C, and D that have passed into history. This leaves a fairly large group of women who have to wear shoes that are too tight because “Medium” is too narrow for them. It causes foot troubles and makes the podiatrists rich. They should be agitating for manufacturers to supply the missing widths but they don’t. Instead, they have a wacky solution to the problem: they surgically narrow the feet of women who desperately crave to wear the latest designer shoes. So Daz, you have to give up your superior attitude and start believing women who cannot wear three inch heels, not because of the height but because they can just never get shoes that fit them properly. You did not know the facts but you said a few rash things that you need to apologize for. My second point is about comparing heel heights that seems to bother some. It is obvious that a five inch heel on a size nine shoe forms much less of an incline for the foot than the same heel on a size five shoe does. I once posted a table of equivalent heel heights that correspond to four, five and six inch heels in US size nine but it seems to have scrolled off this board. Here I want to suggest a personal factor that you can use to determine what your heel height corresponds to when scaled up to a US size nine shoe. First, put your bare foot on a sheet of paper. Draw a line behind your heel and another line parallel to it in front of your toes. Measure the distance between these two lines in inches and divide it by ten. This is your personal factor. Now measure the heel height of your shoe and divide it by your personal factor. This tells you what your heel height would be if scaled up to size nine. Or you can go backwards too. If you want to know what a five inch heel on a size nine shoe corresponds to in your shoe size, multiply five (the heel height for size nine) by your personal factor and you get its equivalent in your own shoe size. It is this equivalent height that should be referred to when comparing actual physical heel heights. Some manufacturers will scale the heels according to shoe size but others don’t and to find out which is the case you will need to measure it yourself. And one more thing. It is not true that wearing heels causes knee damage as one of you claims. This misinformation keeps popping up despite studies showing that it is false.

[new_look]

Arno, if you read my posts you will realise that my post never contained 'a superior attitude' you would also notice that the people i referred to eg my gf and my cousin are the same size but one to me, therefore steeper inclines not an issue. also jade is a thin girl with what you would call average feet, and her shoes do fit ok. If anyone it is going to be my naturally wider mens feet in a narrow womens shoe having the worse fit. as said by a few people, it is down to the ability/flexibility of the individual rather than personal inhibited/learnt skills. as for apologising, i believe that after the storm had passed, explanations had been posted, argument over, as you burst in trying to light the fire about facts already discussed, and without obviously reading the post, i think it would be good for you to apologise, and let the thread continue as we were trying to. daz

[Arno]

My, my, you do have an attitude, Daz.

[genebujold]

Moved by Gene' Bujold to new thread in the For Everyone forum.

[hoverfly]

Uh guys, I think we are missing somthing here, we were asked to leave this thread as it was ment for the Girls only topic here. If the Guys would like to coutunie we can start another thread.

[new_look]

i agree, but some people insist of repeatedly attacking me, when they havent even read the thread or half the argument, and i like anyone have a right to defend myself.

[Vanity]

Hi dear friends, alive and kickin', but still a bit low, as you can understand. You gals, Lucy and Anne-Louis, thanks for your support. I will still be with you on this forum, but it will take some time before I can engage myself like earlier. My dear mother takes nearly all my time. My love to you all, for your concern!

[JeffM]

Hi Vanity I am so glad you have decided not to leave us. I have been trying to convince Rubbervicki to come back. I dont know if I will succeed or not but you may be able to help by emailing her, please check your PM. Best wishes Jeff

[Arno]

genebujold - You claim an abundance of high heels available in wide sizes from Nordstrom’s and other leading stores. I checked Nordstrom’s Web site and found it not to be true. They did have a few wider sizes, mostly for heels under three inches, not for all manufacturers and all styles, never for all sizes in a style, and nothing designated 4A or 3E. I also checked the Web site for Saks Fifth Avenue for designer shoes between $200 and $900 in price. They listed numerous designers but only Stuart Weizman had a few wider sizes, and again not for all sizes in a model. On the Web Fredericks does not have any wider sizes at all and Sexy Shoes shows only one (4212) out of a dozen or more styles they sell. These exceptions just prove the rule that high heels are made only in one width - at least over 95% of the time.

You also expressed your opinion about damage from wearing high heels so I might as well put things in perspective. First of all, foot problems that are attributed to wearing high heels are the same problems that plague runners and are well known to sports medicine specialists. Tendonitis is one of them and it also occurs in ballet dancers. But to include knees, hips and back as being impacted by high heel wear is simply silly. And blaming high heels for osteoarthritis of the knee is dead wrong. When the Harvard study claiming this came out it was obvious that they did not know anything about it for they had exactly zero observations in support of a theory that paid no attention to the skeletal differences between men and women. For a more current medical assessment of high heels, go to:

http://washingtontimes.com/national/20030929-103356-6719r.htm

This should straighten you out about those “false studies” you talk about. Let me make it absolutely clear that I never opined anything about what a person wears: it is their business and theirs alone. Furthermore, it was not my intent to make anyone feel like a schmuck. However, if you find that the shoe fits, don’t hesitate to put it on.

[Rob]

Hi Vanity, I’m very disappointed to see that your thread has been hijacked in such a way. I do hope that it doesn’t put you off of posting here, as the posts of you and the other ladies here are very much appreciated. Please guys, try to respect that this is the "For the gals" forum. We don’t want to lose any more ladies from here.

[Becky]

Well, that's men for you - they have little or no respect for women. If they had then they wouldn't be constantly hijaking our section of the forum The moderators are equally to blame as well - why don't they do their job properly and delete those posts that are from the guys? Is it any wonder why there aren't that many girls left or that we don't post too often - you guys are just skulking around like vultures waiting to pounce on your next female pray with your repetitive questions of "what size heels do you wear", "what style shoes do you like". There are many genuine gentlemen here: Bubba, Firefox, Hoverfly, Trolldeg, Highluc but there arethose that just can't keep away from the girls section. Is it so difficult for you guys to post in the "For Everyone" section - us girls do look at other sections you know, we don't just stay in the girls section. So, do us a favour and stop hijaking before there are no gals left

[xaphod]

Becky,

Deleting all the guys posts on the girls' bit would provoke anarchy. Yes we can do it, but I propose a less confrontational approach. I've already made my views known by posting the poll asking whether the girls' section should be for girls only and I've supported Vanity in the rant forum.

A bit of a rant on behalf of the girls.

Why is it that some guys keep trying to hit on girls who are just out there minding their own business?

There is the girls' forum for the girls, but what do we find, lots of the guys on the board trying to engage them in conversation there .... post us a picture and do you wear 6" heels seem to feature fairly early in the chat. What I think the girls' forum should be is the sort of chats women have in the powder room away from the guys.

There were a couple of Italian girls who posted on the board a while back, but they soon stopped posting when they started a private email conversation, no doubt due to the tedious hassle they got from the guys here, like two girls having a drink at a bar trying to repel the local 'Don Juan'.

Why can't the guys enjoy the company of the few women who post here without there being a covert sexual agenda ????

Vanity, I'm sorry to hear of your loss .... been there a couple of years ago. I'm trying to do my bit to keep the 'dribbling little perverts' at bay, so try to stay with us.

Xa

Becky, I'm quite willing to try to reduce the intrusion of guys into the girls' forum by adopting any reasonable suggestion short of wholesale zapping of posts.

Xa

[Francis]

we have noticed that despite many requests by moderators and the female members that many men are still posting in the gals section. Usually this is sending the thread off topic. Spare a thought for the women. It's akin to having a group of girls trying to have a conversation and then then having a bunch of guys dive in and continue their own chat while drowning out the girls. We appreciate that you guys like to get involved, but can we please respect a few boundaries. We're not asking much and it doesn't take much effort to restrain yourselves. Some of us can read without replying. In fact, I think this is my first reply in about a year in the girls section, but this is only because I feel that we moderators need to take control of the situation. Now the book has been thrown, I will apologise to all the girls for the intrusion, even if it is in their interests. ps. I don't think that wholesale zapping of posts will solve anything. All it will do is cause more animosity.

[Bubba136]

Moderators could always move men's posts into another category called "men's responses to woman's posts," couldn't they?

[Arno]

Becky and Vanity - I apologize. My only excuse is that even though I did not start it I had to straighten out some uppity kids.

[Francis]

Moderators could always move men's posts into another category called "men's responses to woman's posts," couldn't they?

and how do you propose to follow the conversation?

anyway, off topic for this thread. sorry girls!

please desist

[Firefox]

Well, we are looking at the moderation situation for the girl's forum. We did have some great female mods in Debbie, Inga, and Laurie but for various reasons they're no taking an active part at the moment. I'm going to lock this thread and repost the topic on behalf of Vanity. Perhaps I could appeal again that people try and stick to the subject and not use the new thread for personal confrontations whatever the rights and wrongs of your position.