Ebay sniping!

chris100575 · May 24, 2004

I've just been outbid on a very nice pair of black leather knee boots. Fair enough, except that the person who outbid me did it in the last 30 seconds. I know it's not against the rules, but it's still a crappy thing to do. Chris

ShockQueen · May 24, 2004

It's definitely not a nice thing to do, but unfortunately it happens all the time. You hit it spot on when you titled this thread "sniping", as that's what it's commonly referred to. In fact, there are even programs out there that I've been told about that will assist you in making sure you get in the last bid....even in the last 10 seconds. I hope you eventually get a nice pair that you've been hoping for.

PJ · May 24, 2004

Remember this famous quote?

"All is fair in love and war and bidding on eBay."

Here is a site that has some info for people not familiar with sniping on auction sites: http://www.cricketsniper.com/target_price_theory.html

Bubba136 · May 24, 2004

I don't blame anyone for sniping on eBay. If the item is so desired by a bidder, it's his responsibility to keep track of bids so he can win it. The last few seconds in any operation are crutuia to it's successl. it is usually a time frame where you can't take any action due to the time it takes for your reaction to take effect.

PJ · May 24, 2004

I just learned about a new auction site today called http://www.bid4assets.com/

They have a way of dealing with sniping. An auction does not end until a specified amount of time has lapsed after the last bid. If necessary, overtime periods are created to extend the end time until that lack of bidding activity time period has been met.

asdf174 · May 24, 2004

I swear I'm like the only person in the world that dosen't go to ebay at least the only person that dosen't bid on anything. Then again I don't have a credit card. But I did see this one really kick ass pair of mules on their once. I doubt I will be able to find that style again. *sigh*

coolshoes · May 24, 2004

My solution to the sniping problem is to decide the maximum that I am willing to pay and enter that as a bid. Having done that the system automatically raises my bid in increments to keep it the highest until my maximum is reached. That way if someone bids more than I did, they paid more than I was willing to; and if no one wants to outbid me, I do not have to pay as much as I was willing to pay. Also, keeps me from over bidding in a competitive bidding war with other folks.

sscotty727 · May 24, 2004

Coolshoes, I do exactly the same. One thing I have found (if you can have the patience) is to put your max bid when about 1min left. If you put max too early you can also get in a bidding war. I got my wife a pair of shoes doing just that! Scotty

hoverfly · May 24, 2004

I just bid on boots and shoes that you can no longer get else where, or are in a hard to find large size. Some times the prices between E-bay and your online store is not so big that it's not worth the hassle biding.

WarrenB · May 25, 2004

I was outbid on, of all things, a vcr that way. Oh well, I did just buy a much better one recently. One of those Duth Auctions.

chris100575 · May 25, 2004

I've found another pair of boots that I like more than the original ones I was bidding on. This time I just put in my maximum bid from the off. Of course the danger now is that if the bids get too close to mine I'll be tempted to raise it further. This could get expensive! Chris

genebujold · May 25, 2004

I just learned about a new auction site today called http://www.bid4assets.com/

They have a way of dealing with sniping. An auction does not end until a specified amount of time has lapsed after the last bid. If necessary, overtime periods are created to extend the end time until that lack of bidding activity time period has been met.

I like that idea. Only to speed things up and keep people glued to their little 15" online auction bidding microscreens, I'd make the bidding time variable, with one condition: If the bidding has not increased more than 10% within any 60-minute period, the bidding is complete and it's a sale!

That'll keep the merchandise moving - and probably at much higher prices that it would if you gave people have a chance to think about it.

Bubba136 · May 25, 2004

I attend "real" auctions quite regularly. One thing most well trained auctioneers do is constantly strive to get a higher bid by chanting the amount of a bid that is higher than the last one before banging the gavel and saying "sold" for (what ever the amount of the last bid was). The auction remains ongoing until bidders run out of steam and the bidding stops...Then, and only then does the auctioneer bring the sale to climax. It's a good thing....exciting in some instances. ( I attended an auction not to long ago where the bidder became so excited over an item that he ended up bidding against himself before his wife poked him in the ribs and told him to shut up because he was the only one bidding and everytime he opened his mouth, it cost him more money. )

sscotty727 · May 25, 2004

I've found another pair of boots that I like more than the original ones I was bidding on. This time I just put in my maximum bid from the off. Of course the danger now is that if the bids get too close to mine I'll be tempted to raise it further.

This could get expensive!

Chris

Chris,

After having this happen to me several times, this is why I wait until the last minute to up my bid. The other day I was trying to get my wife a pair of shoes and I kept going back and forth with this other person upping our bid. I finally got smart and just waited until just under 1min left and put my max bid in. I did end up paying over twice the starting price though! I know it doesn't seem "fair", but that is the rules of Ebay and that is why you have a time feature, to give everyone a fair chance to put in their price.

On another pair of shoes I was "winning" I also opened two browser windows, one with a new higher bid ready to place if I got outbid, and one watching the auction. If I got outbid at the last minute, I was ready to alt-tab over and hit submit. It all depends on how bad you want the item.

Good luck with your new boots!

Scotty

chris100575 · May 25, 2004

Scotty, hmm that two window idea's not bad! I'm on nights at the moment, and I'm already planning to get up two hours earlier than I would normally to keep on eye on the last half hour of the auction. I really want these boots, but unfortunately there is a limit to what I can afford to pay for them. I have a higher absolute maximum bid in reserve for if it goes to the wire, I just hope that it's enough if I need to use it! Will post piccies if I win. Chris

sscotty727 · May 25, 2004

I had something similar happen to me. My max on a pair was $20 and someone pushed me to it. I was afraid of being caught at the last minute, so I bumped it up to $30. The only problem was that Ebay caused me to outbid myself by 50 cents. If you already set a max and try to bump it up, it might put it at the next increment ABOVE your previous max, so you need to be careful. BTW, I too have stayed up "late" for items me or my wife have really wanted so I know how you feel. Again, best of luck! Scotty PS: Another tip I found helps. If I see something I like and it is DAYS away, I add to my "watch" list and keep an eye on it. When it gets down to the last day I make my move. If you bid too early there is a good chance of the item going up in price pretty quickly!

genebujold · May 26, 2004

After having this happen to me several times, this is why I wait until the last minute to up my bid. The other day I was trying to get my wife a pair of shoes and I kept going back and forth with this other person upping our bid. I finally got smart and just waited until just under 1min left and put my max bid in. I did end up paying over twice the starting price though! I know it doesn't seem "fair", but that is the rules of Ebay and that is why you have a time feature, to give everyone a fair chance to put in their price.

On another pair of shoes I was "winning" I also opened two browser windows, one with a new higher bid ready to place if I got outbid, and one watching the auction. If I got outbid at the last minute, I was ready to alt-tab over and hit submit. It all depends on how bad you want the item.

Scotty

Two windows - there's a novel approach!

Other forms of auction include:

1. Open bid with time limit (eBay). Bidding stops as set time expires.

2. Open bid with no time limit. Auction stops as the length of time between bids exceeds a set limit. Works fine for a captive audience.

3. Sealed bid with time limit.

I think eBay might very well profit from the second form, open bid with no time limit, provided they advertise the item and the start of bidding well in advance. This method would require, however, significantly more advanced server technology as the bids will be flowing over a five to thirty minute period, and not five days or so.

chris100575 · May 27, 2004

I won! I slept past the auction ending, but to be honest I'd already pretty much resolved myself to sticking with my original maximum bid as the more sensible option.

Anyway, here they are! Woohoo, another suede pair!

Chris

Firefox · May 27, 2004

Why is sniping such a problem? Decide on your max bid, put that up in reserve, and walk away in peace. Whether you were sniped or outbid few hours before the auction closed, it makes no difference. Your max bid was beaten. Surely when it was beaten is of no consequence.

chris100575 · May 27, 2004

Because I'd like to have the option of reviewing my maximum bid and possibly increasing it. I don't have a problem with being outbid, it's the fact that by placing a bid in the last thirty seconds the intention was obviously for the auction to end before I got the outbid notice, therefore not giving me chance bid again. And it worked. It's like a trick my little brother used to employ when playing Streetfighter. He learned the fireball special move, and every fight used to just camp in the corner of the screen and fireball you to death. It's not against the rules, and it's quite effective, but it still made me want to slap him. Chris

Firefox · May 27, 2004

If there is a possibility of increasing your maximum bid, it wasn't your maximum bid

chris100575 · May 27, 2004

You've got me with that one! I sometimes have difficulty deciding on a maximum, and have been tempted to increase it a couple of times. It's a good job I don't gamble! It took an effort of will to not bump it up further before I went to bed. It's been harder with this one because I love suede boots, and I lost out on a pair a couple of months ago. I've been scouring Ebay since looking for another pair! It's less stressful when I stick to DVD's and stuff... Chris

onyourtoes · June 5, 2004

Leaving all the "world's marketplace" and "bid in the nude" hype aside, the most important difference between ebay and live auctions is the fixed closing time.

Fortunately for sellers there are always bidders who have to be the high bidder at every moment. ebay's own advice in their help, etc., encourages this because it will maximize their fees.

Since every bid raises the price, why place any bids before the end? I usually set up the bid with esnipe.com and forget about it until I receive the winning or losing email notification.

The best defense against snipers is a good proxy bid placed very late in the auction. If you place it early, then someone is going to keep upping their bid until they're once again the high bidder.

But remember, a snipe is not a guaranteed win. If someone else's proxy bid is higher, the sniper won't have time to raise their bid and will lose.

An exception is if an item has a buy it now price that is more than I'm willing to pay -- then a minimum bid will remove the buy it now option from the auction so it can run its course until the last second snipe.

On the other hand, some of the best bargains can be had by watching the auctions just opening with buy it now prices that are too low -- these items don't last long.

Yahoo has optional automatic extensions, and hardly anybody uses the feature.

June 5, 2004

ok, two thngs...

1 - if you get out bid at the end then this only works if their 'snipe' bid is more than yours. so as firefox suggests place yourmax price and it will be the winner until someone outbids and by that point it's probably got more expensive than what you wanted to pay.

2 - if you can't beat them, join them.. try these wb sites, it's true that sniping will geenrally get you a better price because you don't need to get into a bidding war!

http://www.auctionsniper.com/

http://www.auctionstealer.com/

both sites will give you a few free snipes and i've used both sucessfully. but alos have been outbid using them, i..e. if somene elses max is more than my snipe bid.

happy bidding!

chris100575 · June 5, 2004

Hi Bob. I've signed up with auctionstealer, and have a snipe bid queued at the moment. I still regard sniping as an underhand trick, but if everyone else is doing it... Chris

dressboots · June 7, 2004

Rules that work for me on eBay. Know the market. If you really want something, bid expected retail and you have a good chance at winning it. Many times a similar product can be purchased from a business, thus bidders are not willing to go higher than that. Bidding wars can have a discouraging effect on competition but do not go higher than you inteneded at the start. It is to say do not take it personally. Re. Snipers. Bid your TOP amount then "walk away." if you want to compete with the snipers but do not want to go with the programs/services, bid an hour or less before the end of the auction with your top amount. Sometimes I have been outbid anyway, but other times have won the item and for less than my top reserve bid. At times the bid history reveals the action of a "sniper" who ran out of time looking for my maximum. That is a hazard of snipe bidding in small increments, a method many use, that the clock will run out before their competitor's maximum is found. I too had major disappointments in the past when my bid remained tops for days only to be outdone in the last seconds of an auction. Just remember whetehr you get out bid 6 days or 1 second before the end of the auction, the person who won it paid more than you were willing to pay. Also it helps to have a guarded atttiude about outcomes until the auction is done. "Walking up" auctions through the course of several days to try to phsyc out competition can be done. It is to say, do not bid your top amount to begin with, but come back and ramp up the your bid whenever someone else bids against you. It takes more attention to the auction than I prefer to devote, but it is an option.

sscotty727 · June 7, 2004

My rationale for waiting until the last minute to bid isn't to try to win the item, it is to try to pay the least amount for the item IF I win it. For example, say an item goes on sale for $5 and has 6 days to go. If I put a max bid of $20 in, then person X comes in and put a $6 bid it, the amount will go to $6. They can then continue to upping the bid until it goes higher (maybe $15) to my max ($20). This has actually happened to me! But let's say I just put the item on my watch list and wait. Person X comes in and bids $5 (lets say person X doesn't put in a Max). When I put my $20 max bid in at the end, I can get the item for $6 instead of $20. If it goes higher but I still win it fine. If it goes to $20 and I lose it, fine again, $20 was my max. But like I said, my strategy is to pay the least amount while trying to win the item. Scotty

chris100575 · June 8, 2004

I won! I did end up going above my original maximum, but only by £1. There had been a bidding war between two other users which had pushed the price up. My one and only bid was thrown in 15 seconds before the end, and netted me a nice new pair of shoes which I'm wearing as I write this! Unfortunately I have little self-control when it comes to the acquisition of shoes, and now have to make a concerted effort not to bid on any more until next month at least. Dressboots, you're right about not taking it personally. I really need to learn to not get attached to an item before I win it! Chris

dressboots · June 12, 2004

scotty: I completely understand tyring to get something for as low a price as possible. I did not mean to imply otherwise. You offer insight to the bidding process I had not thought of. I should qualify an early statement. If I can get something from a regular "mainline" business that I typically do not buy it via the eBay forum. However, many businesses use eBay to promote their wares and at starting bids well below what they charge normally, so if you can get it there and at opening bid, it results in considerable savings. I have had some purcahses on eBay that were remarkble in lowness of price and some that were not so low in price. Obviously the getting things way below expected market are the ones that most please me. Somethings are plain not available anymore so final bid price is anyone's guess. It becomes the thrill of successfully acquiring something available though no other venues.

sscotty727 · June 12, 2004

Dressboots, I perfectly understand. When I offer advice here, I talk from experience, but from pre-planning. I have gotten burnt too many times the other way, lost items or paid double what I originally planned because I have made every mistake you could make. I simply was offering ideas so others could enjoy what I have found works pretty good without having to get burnt as I have. Whatever works for you, I say go for it! If any of the tips I have offered helps you out, then great! This is what a community is for, to share ideas and help each other out. We can all learn from each other. That said, I just hope we don't all start going against each other For myself, I am staying off Ebay, I have spent WAY too much money lately and need to take a break. Good luck, Scotty

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