Saddam Captured!

[Anita C.]

Now it's just going to be a whole lot of media attention and money spent on Saddam unnecessarily. Photo ops & press bullshit for the benefit of our "Elected Officials" harrumping for the media . . . And the beat goes on.

[Vanity]

I agree with Firefox. War, what is it good for? It just kills and hurts innocent people. In this case Saddam was the bad guy. Who's next? Where? If you think the war is won you fool yourself, it's just beginning. It will be like when the Russians tried to take Afganistan, they couldn't. Fanatic muslims are a bigger threat to us than Hitler, Stalin and all of them together. It's the religion not the country, but does it help to bomb them back to stone-age? /Ninni

[j-turbo2002]

I would quickly like to focus on something that Bubba said very quickly. The reason that these people are anti-American is for the plain fact that they are very resentful, pessimistic, and negative individuals who are afraid to take risks and make unpopular decisions. Now most of you know me. The words pessimism and negativism are not in my vocabulary; which is why I am the successful person that I am today. Believe me, when you have this cowardly attitude, you get nowhere in life. You just end up becoming a big, fat failure. You have pretty much just blown all of your chances of success in life. And this applies to all people who have this attitude. I have seen it happen to one person after another - they always fail in the end. Thinking postitive is something that is very hard to do. Not everyone can do it. Believe me, it takes a lot of work. Being a failure, pessimist, and negative are so easy to do. When was the last time you walked into your library and checked out a book on failure? You are not going to do it because there are no books on failure - it is easy to do. Look at all of the people who sell books on thinking positive and having a positive attitude - they are making millions of dollars/pounds. J

[azraelle]

I think they ought to sentence Saddam to a life sentence of community service in Kurdish Iraq--such as serving as a human urinal--with the only stipulation being that they can't kill him. THAT would be justice. Anything else is just a farce.

[Dr. Shoe]

It's not that any of us are really anti-American, not in the slightest in fact. I regard American individuals as lovely friendly people living in a great country and when I lived there and on subsequent visits I have been welcomed wherever I went. However, my particular feelings on that subject do not extend to the POLITICS and the FOREIGN POLICY of the Bush administration. I'm sure he is a very amiable chap but it is some of his policies that are being criticised here, not the person himself nor the people of America. If anyone here IS anti-american, then that is their right but that does not neccessarily make them pessimistic or negative, they just don't like something in much the same way as some people don't like chopped liver. Some people don't like the French, actually, come to think of it no one likes the French , but the point is, it is their choice. Just because you don't like George Bush doesn't make you a coward. BTW J-Turbo, have you notice that the only people who become rich and successful from these "Motivational" books are the people who write them? If they sell in their millions, why are there not millions of rich, successful people around? the best way to become positive and motivated is by associating with other who are how you wnat to be. This is why there are so many people in the US visiting analysts and counsellors so often is because their role models are neurotic wrecks themselves. Have you noticed that "Analyst" starts with "Anal"? I do agree that gaining a positive mental attitude does take work and that some people do benefit from reading these kinds of books, after all, I've read plenty myself! During WWI, the British by way of a certain TE Lawrence was able to mobilise the Arabs, the Kurds (if memory serves) and many of the Bedouin and Toureg tribes in North Africa against the Turks and their allies. In return, these people were promised independence and that the European powers would let them run their own affairs. However, the french were much displeased about this arrangement and demanded that the region should be split between Britain and France. When the war ended, the British and French very much outstayed their welcome. All I want is for America not to make the same mistake. The problem is, we have a tiger by the tail. If we just walk away now, we leave a power vacuum that could well be filled by a moderate, pro-western, secular, democratic government (which would be good all round) or could be filled by sword waving fundamentalists and no one would want that (except perhaps the sword waving fundamentalists). Kill Stan or not kill him we could lose either way if it is not done properly. It's true that the US (and British) military and governments have some very, very clever people working for them, but are they always listened to? I think not is a general rule. I agree with Vanity, Stan was and always has been a strutting fool like all the dictators that have ever gone before him, he was never a credible threat to the US or UK any more than Gaddafi or Mugabe are. The biggest threat is from the terrorists. Hitting Afghanistan was a positive move against terrorism, invading Iraq was not IMHO. Have you noticed how Gaddafi has been on his best behaviour the last few years? Anita C (I love you) was right too, Stan was captured just as the presidential campaigns are going to start again and about a year before Bliar has to set a date for a general election here too. I bet both he and Bush are wishing it could have happened six months later! As sometimes happens, I agree with JT(!) on the issue of saving face. Most Moslems I know aren't even aware of the concept, they do hold great store in dignity and respect, particularly in the Indian sub-continent but that is largely and Indian thing rather than a Moslem one. The Arabian Moslems have some traditions which we would find strange, such as only using the right hand to eat, belching after a meal and always turning away the last dish. Most of these traditions and customs have little to do with Allah and much to do with living in the desert where water is so valuable you don't waste it by washing your hands so you do dirty jobs like wiping your arse with the left and clean jobs like preparing and eating food with the right. I don't think that Xaphod really believes that ALL Moslems share Bin Liner's views, it's just that they are all around us and you never know who they are. Look at Shoe-Bomber wossname Reid (can't remember his first name) he was a recent convert and no one ever suspected that he would ever do such a thing, everyone thought he was a really nice guy. Actually, I think that most Moslems would be heartened by the fact that Stan has been caught and is no superman and human enough to submit to such a humiliating examination, you must remember that he led a secular government that all but outlawed any kind of worship and exiled many of the top Iraqi clerics. Pakistanis can be confrontational and stubborn little blighters at the best of times, give them a Degree and they can be unbearable. there are exceptions of course. BTW JT, precisely how many Civil Wars has the US had? I'm curious because I'm only aware of one. And how can a government like the US possibly install a government that is an improvement on the UK's when they are no better themselves? Build a couple of thousand McDonalds outlets perhaps hmm? Perhaps they're planning to introduce a Florida style democracy, or perhaps a glorious administration like that under Nixon? Or perhaps they may install a president with the same moral standards as Clinton. Our current government might not be perfect but this is probably the only government that followed the US into a stupidly pointless war. BTW, it was a THEORY.

[Firefox]

These people will not fight one another because we will show them how to live with one another. We know a lot about teaching people how to live with one another (of different races and cultures) after it has gone to war with itself. Remember, the U.S. has gone through many civil wars. We will teach the Iraqis...

Some pretty arrogant concepts but somehow I figure you meant it that way I don't have a clockwork spring though, so it was amusing

[Anita C.]

"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and irritates the pig." The US has been judged regarding since it became a country. Inspite of these judgements we have stayed the course. We don't let Monday Morning Quarterbacks useless opinions influence our direction because "would have, could have and should have" never did anything worthy of mention at ANY point in time. It's EASY to judge a game from the BENCH or from the safe confines of a forum whining about what happened AFTER it has happened and harrumping about "Well, it SHOULD HAVE been done . . ." as you take a sip of another martini. If you weren't there at the point in time, your opinion is virtually useless. As far as what the "Moslems" think? First-learn how to spell. It is M U S L E M. And dealings with a group of Pakistani engineers hardly qualify as comparable experience when you are a ground soldier looking down the barrel of a Soviet-made AK 47. It's like listening to a hooker talking about chastity or the Pope giving marital advice.

[j-turbo2002]

Some pretty arrogant concepts but somehow I figure you meant it that way I don't have a clockwork spring though, so it was amusing

Their not pretty arrogant concepts. They are true historical facts.

Do you people study History over there or is it a thing of the past?

[Firefox]

I don't know whether to laugh or but I think I'll :rofl: Please don't apply for Kofi Annan's job any time within the next millenium unless shaken, stirred & reincarnated :drinking:

[j-turbo2002]

I don't know whether to laugh or but I think I'll :rofl: Please don't apply for Kofi Annan's job any time within the next millenium unless shaken, stirred & reincarnated :drinking:

I wouldn't worry. In years to come the UN will be abolished.

[j-turbo2002]

Dr. Shoe, First of all I really like the British people. They too welcomed me lovingly with open arms while I was there. You are right about the policies. In my opinion, Bush really could care less about what the Europeans think and it is driving the Europeans insane. However, during this time it is not wise decision for Europeans to be whining, crying, and protesting about the situation. I understand that it is their right in all to do so however, these actions will not solve anything; rather it just makes things worse for everyone. I can’t answer for the people who write the books. I have never read any of them myself. I just naturally have “the gift”. There are millions of rich successful people around. Unfortunately you are just too blind to see them. You need to try opening up your eyes sometime. The key to being positive all of the time is a mental mindset. You really have to be a strong person in a mental sense. It has absolutely nothing to do with associating with other people. Remember, the “other people” are not positive all of the time. I just want to let you know that I am NOT saying that it is a bad idea to have friends or colleagues or anything like that. About the analysts in the U.S. – I am not going to touch that because I don’t know a whole lot about that issue and from the looks of it neither do you. You are only aware of one civil war because you don’t know your history very well - as I well know. We have had many civil wars in this country. We have had wars over slavery, the rights of women, civil rights, religious rights, gay rights, and the list goes on and on. You never hear about them because they are “silent” civil wars. Don’t be knocking McDonald’s – when I was last in Brittan I noticed that you Brits hardly passed one up while walking by. Our form of government is better because you are free, you have rights, and, as you correctly pointed out, the policy is constantly changing. The only people who call the war pointless are people like yourself who wanted to see thousands of human beings being slaughtered like cattle by a brutal dictator. ***EDIT 1*** To be quite honest with you, when Saddam was captured I thought about you! I really did! I thought about the Tears of Sadness that were rolling down your face as Saddam was taken into custody. Your hero's days were finally numbered! ********* Believe me, although unpopular by some, fighting the war in Iraq was one of the most humane things that the U.S. has ever done. Remember, we made some huge sacrifices so that the Iraqi people could be free and that is all that matters. ***EDIT 2*** About the issue of being anti-American: I am sorry my friend, I have payed close attention to what the Brittish media has reported and and I have seen the interviews done with the protestors on the streets of London and it is just pathetic. I also have a problem with the groups who organized those marches. I have thought about what you said and to be honest with you, it just does not add up at all. Your analysis is just a cheap "red herring" diversionary tactic away from the real issue at hand. I pretty much summed it up correctly with my first post on the anti-American issue. ********

[Anita C.]

WW I? Dr. Shoe for Gods' sake - that was then, this is NOW! The "Lads" who fought in WW I and WW II are for the most part dead, God rest their souls. My Son has looked down the business end of an AK 47 . . . have you? If not, what in hell are you basing your opinion upon? The inane ramblings of other pseudointelectuals who also have never been in combat but sit away safely in their own little world judging the actions of those who are, as my son puts it "In the S***" up close & personal? My Son has some advice for you. "Tell this putz to pick up a rifle and walk a post in an unfriendly foreward area-then we can talk. Untill then tell him he can say "thank you" to us for the security and safety which SOLDIERS provide for him and not have the pompous, self-rightous audacity to question how we go about it. Spc. M. K. ***** 101st Airbourn, United States Army. Serving in Baghdad, Iraq." Period - End of story.

[Firefox]

Personal attacks and insults are not allowed under the board posting guidlines. I hope we can continue without those.